Sadly,it is time to drop UGA...

GTSaxophone

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This isn't about being pigheaded, and emotional. Logically, few of your points make any sense. Your rationale about playing other big teams is counter-intuitive, unless you don't really care about the fact that we're losing to uga, rather that we're just playing the same team year in and year out. Losing every year to a marquee team sucks whether you're in BDS, South Bend, Austin, LA, or wherever. If you concede that we can never wish to compete against uga, you essentially concede we can never wish to compete against any of the football factories out there. They have the same set of advantages over us, and a few of them have even larger ones than uga does. You're trading one headache for another one, as the novelty of traveling to exotic locations, or having those teams come here wears off after a while when you're losing to them. (Again, this is all under the assumption we've made that we can't compete by running from uga)

You're also badly underestimating the ramifications the decision would have when it comes to recruiting instate. Maybe (only maybe) would the backlash subside nationally, but you can't tell me you don't expect any coach recruiting for uga, any HS coach with connections to uga, nor any one in this state to ever let anyone forget that we tucked tail and ran away from them. That we shouted to everyone, "We can't ever hope compete with uga, so we're taking our ball and going home!" You think uga kicks our ass with in-state recruiting? That would be on another level. This isn't about us finishing our recruiting on poor note because of the loss to them. This is about kids in-state being indoctrinated with the fact that Georgia Tech isn't a school to go to if you want to compete at the highest level. We wouldn't be able to dispute that in the slightest, because we would have been the ones who ran from the battle to begin with.

Like I said earlier, you're also dreaming if you think this will galvanize our fanbase. Yes, we get disappointed after losing to uga. Yes, there is a wave of excitement when we actually beat them. However, like recruiting, this is about more than just one week of the year. Our fans take the rivalry seriously, and many just would not be able to stomach dropping the series. Most of those in that category would likely just walk away from the program in disgust, I would think. You would completely fracture the fanbase with a move like this.

Moving the game is a far more productive discussion (although I have been staunchly on record as being against it), though I will point out that for all the crying about depth, playing this game at the end of the season actually benefited us. That is, unless you wanted to have to face them with Murray, Marshall, Mitchell, Gurley without the ankle issue he dealt with all season, and everyone else they lost to injury. Golden would have been a nice weapon for us to have, but do you really think that would have offset the advantage uga would have had with those guys in the lineup? Not to mention the experience in the offense Vad gained throughout the season. Most years, we would be doing ourselves a disservice to play them at the beginning of the year, when they're at full strength themselves (though we may benefit from their annual "Some dumbass gets arrested" suspensions). We definitely don't win in 08, though you could make an argument for it benefiting us in 09 and certainly 10.

At the end of the day, this is a pipe dream that, thankfully, has no chance of happening. Stop the dialogue about running away, and start the dialogue about how to make ourselves better. For all the advantages we complain about them having over us, honestly, it's rare they actually blow our doors off. There is a litany of years where we had a fantastic chance to win, and just crapped the bed. That has everything to do with us needing to have our houses in order first. What do you want from the program? I know I personally want to see us build on where we are now to a point where we can consistently get over the hump in the ACC (we are right there just about every year), and move the needle on the uga series to where we're winning 4 out of 10 minimum. I don't think either of those is a ridiculous expectation, as, again, we flirt with this every single year. We just need to do better, and stop trying to run and hide. This thread is an embarrassment to Tech football.

THWg.
 

GTCrew4b

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To run counter to your point, I actually think we do have a better chance of beating big time programs than we do of beating UGA, but I still don't want to drop UGA, unless it was a one-time thing to accomodate for another traditional SEC rival.

I mean we did beat Auburn, Notre Dame, Southern Cal, and Florida State x 2, in the same span of time we've beaten UGA once.
 

GSUGTATL

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Here goes:

I may be a bit older than you but go back and look at the history of the Pitt game and racial problems, go back and look at the old Georgia School of Commerce, check out UGA's votes in the SEC, etc. To suggest that it doesn't matter in this state, at the BOR, or in the capital bldg is dead wrong.


This is not the first time in my life that I analyzed something and came to a conclusion before others. When you choose to standup you choose to be attacked. I get that and I don't mind it one bit.

If you take the emotion out for a moment and really look at solving our unique problems instate, you may be surprised and come to similar conclusions. I strongly believe the debate is well worth it. Open up and give it a chance.
Dude, u need to get laid BADLY
 

GTSaxophone

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To run counter to your point, I actually think we do have a better chance of beating big time programs than we do of beating UGA, but I still don't want to drop UGA, unless it was a one-time thing to accomodate for another traditional SEC rival.

I mean we did beat Auburn, Notre Dame, Southern Cal, and Florida State x 2, in the same span of time we've beaten UGA once.
Bear in mind that Notre Dame and USC were both going through one of their worst seasons ever, and Florida State was going through a strong malaise at the end of Bobby Bowden's tenure. I'm not trying to take too much away from the wins, but how many of those traditional powers have we beaten when they're playing at their expected high level? We should have beaten a #2 ND, but f$u consistently beat us during their romp through the ACC (even though some games were as agonizingly close as some uga games), and all time we're like 9-27 or something like that against ND. What would make us magically able to play with the other big boys, if we're to assume we can't play with uga? Taking away the added adrenaline of a rivalry game?
 

midatlantech

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A few thoughts:

This isn't about being pigheaded, and emotional. Logically, few of your points make any sense. Your rationale about playing other big teams is counter-intuitive, unless you don't really care about the fact that we're losing to uga, rather that we're just playing the same team year in and year out. Losing every year to a marquee team sucks whether you're in BDS, South Bend, Austin, LA, or wherever. If you concede that we can never wish to compete against uga, you essentially concede we can never wish to compete against any of the football factories out there. They have the same set of advantages over us, and a few of them have even larger ones than uga does. You're trading one headache for another one, as the novelty of traveling to exotic locations, or having those teams come here wears off after a while when you're losing to them. (Again, this is all under the assumption we've made that we can't compete by running from uga) You have chosen to take one positive point and stretched it into something else. If I was running from strong teams nationwide, I wouldn't play FSU, ND, Clemson, and VPI either. We suck against them too after all.
We are in the ACC, we do not have to play UGA. The disadvantages of losing to Miami all the time is not in the same stratosphere of losing instate all the time either.

You're also badly underestimating the ramifications the decision would have when it comes to recruiting instate. Maybe (only maybe) would the backlash subside nationally, but you can't tell me you don't expect any coach recruiting for uga, any HS coach with connections to uga, nor any one in this state to ever let anyone forget that we tucked tail and ran away from them. That we shouted to everyone, "We can't ever hope compete with uga, so we're taking our ball and going home!" You think uga kicks our ass with in-state recruiting? That would be on another level. This isn't about us finishing our recruiting on poor note because of the loss to them. This is about kids in-state being indoctrinated with the fact that Georgia Tech isn't a school to go to if you want to compete at the highest level. We wouldn't be able to dispute that in the slightest, because we would have been the ones who ran from the battle to begin with.
Fact: We get our a#$e$ handed to us in recruiting in the state versus the big boys. So nothing changes here at all.
Secondly you don't have to come out and say "we suck and can never beat UGA, so we are never playing them again." I didn't hear one word when A&M decided to stop playing Texas. Football business decisions are made all the time in life. There is not one thing that would happen any differently than happens already. I think you are way overreaching on this.
And let me point out that UGA cowers all the time. They don't go out and play folks on the road of any note. Where's the outrage? What's the difference?

Like I said earlier, you're also dreaming if you think this will galvanize our fanbase. Yes, we get disappointed after losing to uga. Yes, there is a wave of excitement when we actually beat them. However, like recruiting, this is about more than just one week of the year. Our fans take the rivalry seriously, and many just would not be able to stomach dropping the series. Most of those in that category would likely just walk away from the program in disgust, I would think. You would completely fracture the fanbase with a move like this. Your opinion may be correct, I am not sure. I know who goes to Tech games with me and I bring in about ten or twenty more fans to games every year. Not a single one would give a öööö and since I've stopped going to UGA, I would count as extra (and the ones who I get to go too) as added fans in the stadium for other games.

p.s. In response to above, I also think it's time the fans take the rivalry less seriously. We'd probably win more.

Moving the game is a far more productive discussion (although I have been staunchly on record as being against it), though I will point out that for all the crying about depth, playing this game at the end of the season actually benefited us. We lost the game because we don't have enough big boys by the end of the year and at the end of the game. We couldn't have played any better but 12 OL playing against 4 DL matters in the end. At LB, guys like Watts has to play but how healthy was he for example. There is nobody physical enough behind him to compete so he plays. Compare that to guys coming out of high school ready to play filling out the three deep at UGA (they are physical but not as refined in game 1 by the way). That is, unless you wanted to have to face them with Murray, Marshall, Mitchell, Gurley without the ankle issue he dealt with all season, and everyone else they lost to injury. Injuries go both ways but when you lose one OL for Tech you are losing 1/6th of usable OL. When you lose one OL at UGA you are losing 1/10th. Huge difference. Golden would have been a nice weapon for us to have, but do you really think that would have offset the advantage uga would have had with those guys in the lineup? It's the depth of the lines and really at all positions that matters. Go look at the decay of our defense as the game wore on. Gurley did not run over anybody in OT, he didn't have to. Not to mention the experience in the offense Vad gained throughout the season. This goes both ways too. Most years, we would be doing ourselves a disservice to play them at the beginning of the year, when they're at full strength themselves (though we may benefit from their annual "Some dumbass gets arrested" suspensions). We definitely don't win in 08, though you could make an argument for it benefiting us in 09 and certainly 10. Again, lack of depth kills as the season wears on. Check our first half of the season versus second half records the last fifty years. Add in intangibles such as every team can struggle early and it's a no brainer to me.

At the end of the day, this is a pipe dream that, thankfully, has no chance of happening. Stop the dialogue about running away, and start the dialogue about how to make ourselves better We aren't allowed to have that dialogue at Ma Tech. For all the advantages we complain about them having over us, honestly, it's rare they actually blow our doors off. There is a litany of years where we had a fantastic chance to win, and just crapped the bed. This is one part that kills me when reading on these boards. We 'crap the bed' because we don't have comparable talent and depth. PJ made one bad call in OT end, Vad one bad pass. The rest was darn near perfection but their depth and talent overcame us in the end. Remember all those years that UNC found a way to win bball games in the end? There's a reason. That has everything to do with us needing to have our houses in order first. What do you want from the program? I know I personally want to see us build on where we are now to a point where we can consistently get over the hump in the ACC (we are right there just about every year (again, our boys should be congratulated at many of our games when we come close, but it's a recurring them for fifty years now. Realize why.), and move the needle on the uga series to where we're winning 4 out of 10 minimum. I don't think either of those is a ridiculous expectation, as, again, we flirt with this every single year. We just need to do better (Business Mistake 101), and stop trying to run and hide. This thread is an embarrassment to Tech football.

I do appreciate your input and I hope I didn't sound mean up above but I strongly believe it is an embarassment to Tech to do nothing and keep getting hammered. Do anything differently and I'm on board. I just happen to think the answer lies somewhere in this discussion after thinking everything through for years and years.

Fact: You are not changing the Faculty's or President's position.
Fact: You are not changing the BOR's position.
Fact: You are not changing the state legislature's position.
Fact: You are not changing the local media or now the national media either.
Fact: You are not changing local high school football nor local high school academics.
Fact: You are not appreciably changing Tech's academic offerings and demands.
Opinion: Tech is the single biggest problem with the ACC's weak perception. (This is really a fact.)

Opinion: Tech could make some changes and try to work toward their own strengths.
Opinion: Improvement by Tech in the southeast makes huge ACC strides and generates lots more money for Tech which helps it compete even more.
Fact: Tech can manipulate it's schedule, one of the few things it can do.
Opinion: It can also try new coaches, new stadium deals, new tailgating ideas but none of that seems to make a difference.
Fact: Annually Tech plays one of the toughest schedules in Division 1. And we're adding Notre Dame and other tough opponents in the future.
Opinion: Winning sells. Maybe we could play UGA in the semifinals of the BCS one day after we really rebuild.


THWg.
 

midatlantech

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Dude, u need to get laid BADLY
LOL. Sorry, not this. I'll go away very soon.

Let me add one more thought. If Tech fans want to change what's happening then they have to change too. You can't have your coach on radio making fun of UGA fans working at WalMart. You can't have fans cheering for an injured opponent. You can't have Tech fans degrade 90% of the state's population and expect to fill up your roster with D1 athletes much less the stadium.

Generally young Tech fans need him in social skills and act like it and I am proud to say that that included me at one time. I happen to believe that there are many forms of intelligence. Tech students score okay in IQ. Tech students genetically can solve math problems. But are they good cooks? Can they draw or perform on the stage? Since you asked, how about showing affection, making love? Aren't there other important aspects in life we could appreciate? Maybe we could send a signal that welcomes more fans to our experience?
Opinion: It's not changing here either and hence another reason to look elsewhere for answers. But we are missing an opportunity here.
 
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Allen Koholic

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Opinion: Tech is the single biggest problem with the ACC's weak perception. (This is really a fact.)
It's not a fact, it's complete horseshit.

So is the part about Tech playing a hard schedule. Do some research before you let more stupid come out of your keyboard.
 

midatlantech

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It's not a fact, it's complete horseshit. FSU and Clemson wins about 50% of the time. Who else has something to compare with the SEC, the almighty measuring stick? Also check out bowl records of the last ten years or so. Uh, it has a lot to do with us.

So is the part about Tech playing a hard schedule. Do some research before you let more stupid come out of your keyboard.
Hmmm, this year alone we have the 40th hardest schedule and in my opinion, it was one of the weakest schedules we've ever had. Why do you think Duke won the Coastal? I can remember Top Ten schedules sprinkled fairly regularly for much of the last fifty years. I don't get your response.
 

Architorture23

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why do you keep comparing us to aTm? They didn't stop playing Texas because they couldn't compete. They stopped because they joined the SEC and Texas bounced them off their schedule because they were mad at them for leaving the Big 12.

aTm is better off, not because they aren't playing Texas, but because they ARE playing Alabama, LSU, Auburn, and South Carolina and will also add Florida, Georgia, Tennessee, et al.
 

midatlantech

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why do you keep comparing us to aTm? They didn't stop playing Texas because they couldn't compete. They stopped because they joined the SEC and Texas bounced them off their schedule because they were mad at them for leaving the Big 12.

aTm is better off, not because they aren't playing Texas, but because they ARE playing Alabama, LSU, Auburn, and South Carolina and will also add Florida, Georgia, Tennessee, et al.
Texas A & M felt like they couldn't get a fair shake in the state. Texas' record is 76-37-5 which is better than UGA's record against us. Texas A & M changed the tables on Texas, it was a brilliant move. The difference is, they didn't care crap about continuing the rivalry, they were so sick of the big state school advantages. (The final blow was the Longhorn network.)

A&M has put their stock in building a stronger more competitive conference and that's how they are going to take down Texas as #1 in the state, or at least compete better. We should be focused on exactly the same.

You just don't hear much about A&M being a coward now do you? In fact, when we stopped playing our real old rival Auburn, you didn't hear then either.


By the way, Gary Williams ended up supporting Maryland's move to the Big Ten because he felt they couldn't get out from under UNC/Duke and Tobacco Road.
 

The M-Train

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This whole thread is full retart. We beat UGA in 2008 and had excellent chances to beat them in 2009, 2010, and 2013. If a handful of plays go our way in those 3 games, CPJ is 4-2 against UGA and no one is saying this.

If you think it's time to drop UGA because we are "clearly inferior" when we lost to them in 2OT, you are a complete moron. The average margin of victory for them over the past 10 years is 9.4 points per game, and that's including last year. If you take out last year, it's only 6.2 points per game, which is less than a TD.

If you think 1 TD/game difference over 9 games is a large enough margin to discontinue a century-old rivalry, you're an idiot. 1 bad turnover, 1 defensive stop, 1 made XP, etc. can swing a 7 point game with ease. I hope we never stop playing UGA, and anyone who suggests otherwise is a ööööö.
 

Legal Jacket

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Texas A & M felt like they couldn't get a fair shake in the state. Texas' record is 76-37-5 which is better than UGA's record against us. Texas A & M changed the tables on Texas, it was a brilliant move. The difference is, they didn't care crap about continuing the rivalry, they were so sick of the big state school advantages. (The final blow was the Longhorn network.)

A&M has put their stock in building a stronger more competitive conference and that's how they are going to take down Texas as #1 in the state, or at least compete better. We should be focused on exactly the same.

You just don't hear much about A&M being a coward now do you? In fact, when we stopped playing our real old rival Auburn, you didn't hear then either.


By the way, Gary Williams ended up supporting Maryland's move to the Big Ten because he felt they couldn't get out from under UNC/Duke and Tobacco Road.
There is a big difference between ending the rivalry because you are moving to what is perceived as the strongest conference in the country, home of a billion straight national champions, as opposed to outright dropping the rival you've lost 12 of 13 to.
 

GSUGTATL

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Hmmm, this year alone we have the 40th hardest schedule and in my opinion, it was one of the weakest schedules we've ever had. Why do you think Duke won the Coastal? I can remember Top Ten schedules sprinkled fairly regularly for much of the last fifty years. I don't get your response.
Are you retarded or a troll? It's a sincere question......

Newsflash- nobody gives two öööös about bowl records...do you think AF fans brag about their win over Tech? No...do you think Utah fans brag about their win over Tech(twice) or over Alabama? No.

Bowls(other than the big one) are for entertainment purposes only...nobody gives two öööös that GT beat USC last year, just like nobody gives two öööös LSU beat GT a couple years ago.

I still love the bowls and being in Vegas to put down $$$$ on them each year is fun and doing a buncha bowl contests with family and friends is cool...also, if GT gets a nice destination(Nashville, Orlando, Miami, San Fran, DC, Charlotte, Jacksonville/NYC(starting next year) then yea it makes for a solid trip.

But if you use bowls(other than the big one) to base an argument then you're either a troll or a retard.
 

MatatoGT

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Certainly don't drop the game, that is a ridiculous notion, but...
am I the only one who thinks that this game (as well as FSU/UF & CU/USCe) shouldn't be the last game of the season? Simply because it's a non-conference game. I like what the Iron Bowl was this year, winner goes to the conference championship. Last game should be a division game, try to guarantee some momentum going into the ACCCG. Considering '09 when both us and Clemson were coming off losses to our in-state, out-of-conference, rival, or last year us and F$U, same thing. I would prefer such in-state, out-of-conference, rivalry games to be late October or early November, deep enough into the season that the teams are established, but not the last game. Last game of the regular season should mean more than simply bragging rights.
 

Architorture23

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^^^ win the games and the momentum is bigger than ever.
 

BEEFENSE

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Just logged in and am astonished that this thread is still alive and growing, so i gotta throw my viewpoint into the pot. As I've said many times--I've been a huge Tech fan all my life (over 65 years or since I was old enough to understand college football). To even seriously consider dropping Ugag 'cause we can't compete/win consistently enough is APPALLING to me. I can remember watching/attending Tech victories vs Ugag over the years and each one was EXQUISITE and memorable. I do understand the anger and frustration at losing so many times in recent history but that is the essence of sports competition SOMEONE LOSES. Bad luck, bad breaks, bad ref.s, bad WHATEVER--enters into the reasons why. I could rant on and on about this--BUT--bottom line is that if Tech drops Ugag 'cause we feel we can't "beat" them (we have) or be competitive (we have) THEN I for one will drop college football (not Tech) because college football IS GT to me.
 

midatlantech

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This whole thread is full retart. We beat UGA in 2008 and had excellent chances to beat them in 2009, 2010, and 2013. If a handful of plays go our way in those 3 games, CPJ is 4-2 against UGA and no one is saying this.

If you think it's time to drop UGA because we are "clearly inferior" when we lost to them in 2OT, you are a complete moron. The average margin of victory for them over the past 10 years is 9.4 points per game, and that's including last year. If you take out last year, it's only 6.2 points per game, which is less than a TD.

If you think 1 TD/game difference over 9 games is a large enough margin to discontinue a century-old rivalry, you're an idiot. 1 bad turnover, 1 defensive stop, 1 made XP, etc. can swing a 7 point game with ease. I hope we never stop playing UGA, and anyone who suggests otherwise is a ööööö.
I will make you a wager, a very large one in fact. The wager is simply that over the last 50 years statistics would show that it's not one play, it's not one bad turnover, it's not luck. Please argue loudly that you want to keep the game but if we can't see the facts, we will never make the necessary changes to really compete. And that is the issue.
 

midatlantech

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There is a big difference between ending the rivalry because you are moving to what is perceived as the strongest conference in the country, home of a billion straight national champions, as opposed to outright dropping the rival you've lost 12 of 13 to.

So by coming up with a good excuse to get out of the buttkicking game is okay, but being honest and trying to find other ways to compete doesn't count? Come on. When Miami and VPI joined and some were calling the ACC the best conference, then we should have jumped at that time because it would have sold better? Now that's being a coward.
 

midatlantech

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Are you retarded or a troll? It's a sincere question......

Newsflash- nobody gives two öööös about bowl records...do you think AF fans brag about their win over Tech? No...do you think Utah fans brag about their win over Tech(twice) or over Alabama? No.

Bowls(other than the big one) are for entertainment purposes only...nobody gives two öööös that GT beat USC last year, just like nobody gives two öööös LSU beat GT a couple years ago.

I still love the bowls and being in Vegas to put down $$$$ on them each year is fun and doing a buncha bowl contests with family and friends is cool...also, if GT gets a nice destination(Nashville, Orlando, Miami, San Fran, DC, Charlotte, Jacksonville/NYC(starting next year) then yea it makes for a solid trip.

But if you use bowls(other than the big one) to base an argument then you're either a troll or a retard.
I think I am in the Top 10% for Tech fandom. You can choose to believe the Bottom 10% if you'd like.

Come on guys. Bowl games were brought into the conversation as a very good and simple measure of one's competitive strength. We haven't done a good job representing the conference. If we can't get to that fact, we are much worse off than I ever thought.
 
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