New academic/recruiting thread

GTnut

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Just so I don't have to keep going through all of those I have seen before.
1. Pres Clough is now on "the", an NCAA President's Board. He is hardly likely to ask for any type of change or support any type of change that would lower requirements.
2. NCAA, in all its wisdom, has instituted new requirements for incoming freshmen beginning next fall. Those changes, bottom line, lower the bar for getting recruits in school.
3. Neither, the ACC,, nor GT - thank God, are lowering their requirements. As you probably know, Duke has lowered their requirements for FB to coincide with what they allowed Coach K to do.
4. However, the NCAA has upped (is that a word) their requirements for athletes to cotinue their eligibility. They must name a major their 1st year, they must obtain 40% of the graduation requirements by the end of 2 calendar years and 60% by the end of 3 calendar years of school for that major. Note this is not allowing for a RS year, for a semester of taking remedial courses, or anything else. Eithe you have it or you don't.
5. GT has been criticized from far and wide about our FB and BB graduation rates compared with other NCAA Division 1 schools. GT's President, our AD, and all of our coaches are aware of these rules and "will not" allow GT to continue the past few year's performance.
6. It should be noted that summer school can be used to achieve this "calendar" requirement. However, it should also be known for those of you who attended GT, that the summer class offering for courses needed to meet degree requirements is slim. IN BB, athetes can start the school year, the summer before fall on scholarship, but not in football. It should also be noted, that if a degree requirement for some schools require only 100 hours, like some at Duke, while others require 130 hours, like many at GT, the bar is a little different; and certainly not equal for the athletes.
7. GT is trying to address items in #6 internally and through the NCAA, but Rome wasn't built in a day. Also, realize there are a lot of professors, who think any changes just for the benefit of athletes is ludicrous.
8. Our FB coaches are determining who we can recruit, who they believe will make it through GT and whom they want here to play football. There are some general guidelines that GT has about bring in recruits for visits, etc. I have it on almost, the highest authority, that only one student athlete the coaches wanted to bring in, didn't meet the guideline. The coaches can go through a review and get an exception, even then. I don't know what happened with this case.
9. Bottom line is:
a. I don't think any of us have been lied to about "the hill's limiting of recruiting in GA:
b. With the new rules of NCAA eligibility requirements for this coming fall's recruits, who we recruit has to be affected, and not only GT. By the way, those who recruit JC players, this coming fall will also have to adhere to these requirements.
c. In the last half dozen years, GT almost never brought in more than 9 GA players per year. When we did, look at how many lasted.
d. Based on our verbals YTD, we seem to be doing pretty well, and hopefully we'll have a great recruiting class and then no one will be concerned.
And last, I am as big a "recruiting fan" as almost anyone, but let's face it - neither we nor the gurus who charge for their service know very much about it. You want examples, Brooking and by the way, Bilbo was a pretty highly rated recruit wasn't he; the QB for Fresno State that stepped in after their starting QB went down during mid-season, you know know the one that helped to beat our butt. How highly rated was he, could he learn the plays, could he make the reads, did he have an arm? Heck no, not coming out of HS, I guess he is one of the guys that had no ability and then boom - through osmosis, there he was beating our butts. By the way, he and Bilbo are both RS fresmen.
 
Good informative post, nut.

Do you know what kind of tutoring system is in place at GT?

One more question: when the rules go in, will the existing players have to meet them?
 
Goodness. That's for the work put into this post. Lots of info and interesting stuff.

You're really brought out some extremely good points! Good Job
 
Mustard - can't give you the specifics, but it is my understanding that GT has one of the "best" tutoring systems.
For your other question - no anyone admitted before this incoming fall does not have to meet the new "eligibility" requirements.
 
GTnut,

Good informative post. Hopefully, this will clear up some of the misconceptions and rumor that seem to be floating around.
 
Excellent post GTNut... my thanks to you for the information... great information, and this will certainly affect some of the football factories around the country..
 
This is a very interesting thread. I too believe that Tech has prided itself on being an academic boot camp. Yet I have heard for years that so-called top notch schools like Duke and Stanford, that once you got in and showed effort there was no way you would be unsuccessful... It's like by getting admitted you have become one of a lifelong club. Tech has always eaten its young and chewed up those who love it the most. I have a child there now and tho there are now some "kindler and gentler" facades put forth it is still pretty much like surviving the Bataan death march to "get out" with a degree.

In today's PC environment with college ratings now based on things like faculty:student ratio (how about those freshman calc/chemistry classes with 200 of your dearest friends) and "nurturing" environment, Tech is somewhat out of step with the times. It will be very interesting to see how Ma Tech evolves in this new millenium.

In the context of the NCAA graduation rates however, Tech is caught in a catch 22. How to improve grad rates without watering down a degree program for athletes. How to pave a rosy path for athletes when all the other students must crawl thru the rose bushes, thorns and all!
 
Good post rw1. Yes GT is out of step with the times for sure. As for athletes not enduring the same pain and struggle for survival as regular students....it would take a ugag crap type major for this to happen. Any program GT would likely add, considering how terribly difficult a D-1 football/basketball player's life is, would indeed match the rigor a regular student now endures. I would venture to say that only a small % of our 1400 SATers would succeed even close to the point they do now, if they were subjected to the demands our ballplayers are and they did not receive similar tutoring. I wish the academic snobs would consider this when they climb up on their holier than thou pedestals. THWG
 
Does anybody know whether the degree in the Industrial Management school could be shaped to have a sports management emphasis? If not could we develop a joint degree with Georgia State or Southern Tech or some other school in which our athletes could do enough sports credits for an emphasis in Sports Management Technology.

The selling points then would be first for our grads to have several options:
1. Pro ball
2. Coaching or sports management
3. Industrial management

Also, after pro-ball, #'s 2 & 3 would still be open to the grad.

Secondly, we would then have a major for athletes who are wanting to emphasize sports without doing all the engineering courses. Plus we would still be within the overall purpose of GT's Management school.
 
Not only is our athletic graduation rate poor but so is the rate for regular students. MIT, Duke and Stanford have graduation rates near 100% for all students entering. As a top graduating high school student do I want to go to a school that graduate 60% of the entering students or 100%? This is also a major concern on the hill and has been commented on in public by Clough. Obviously to make this change there would have to be a dramatic overhall in the teaching method at Tech.
 
Good post GTnut. Very informative.

Also, gtmg, it is funny how things change over time. In the past GT was proud of its "survival of the fittest" type education and felt that it would produce the best graduates. Now that they've gotten to much bad press (and I think it affects their national ranking more) they seem to changing their ways.
 
I appreciate the information and I realize that were are somewhat between a rock and hard place with the new NCAA requirements. I still feel that Braine and Clough were misleading with their responses on the call in show. Whether the hill is rejecting players or the coaches are not recruiting players because of direction giving by Braine/the hill, the bottom line is that we can not recruit the same players we could 2 years ago. They are playing the semantics game IMHO. It is also frustrating to me because I don't believe a marginal increase in athlete admision standards will make a large difference in grad rates. There are still a lot of other factors involved, i.e. players getting homesick, frustrated with lack of playing time, lack of majors, etc..
 
Originally posted by GTnut:
4. However, the NCAA has upped (is that a word) their requirements for athletes to cotinue their eligibility. They must name a major their 1st year, they must obtain 40% of the graduation requirements by the end of 2 calendar years and 60% by the end of 3 calendar years of school for that major. Note this is not allowing for a RS year, for a semester of taking remedial courses, or anything else. Eithe you have it or you don't.
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Sorry guys, I screwed that up. But I did want to ask if anyone knew how this requirement might affect us relative to other schools, especially those that have an "academic" track designed especially for their "student"-athletes. If I recall correctly, the 6 Fresno State players suspended for the Silicon Implant Bowl didn't even complete 6 hours of school. If all they are taking is 6 hours there is no way they can meet the academic progress requirements.
 
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