Freshman Participation and Roster Management

cyclejacket

cyclejacket

Not A Fan of Biden BS
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Jul 28, 2002
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We're just over halfway through the season. With 5 games remaining we could still see some changes to those who retain their redshirt. I've tried to go back and look at the participation in games year to date on ramblinwreck.com. I assume it is reasonably correct, with maybe some mistakes related to the duplicate numbers we have for some players. Here's what I found:

The first group has used their freshman eligibility. The second group retains the potential to redshirt. The third group hasn't seen any action through this point.

A. Brown: 7 games
D. Leonard: 7 games (is he PWO or scholarship?)
C. Bennett: 6 games
D. Devenny: 6 games
S. Yondjouen: 6 games
J. Griffin: 5 games
D. Knight: 5 games
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K. Norris: 4 games
J. Huff: 3 games
K. Johnson: 2 games
N. Burnett: 2 games
W. Walker: 1 game
J. Yates: 1 game
==================
Z. Owens
M. Lockhart
T. Amerson
D. Ellison
K. Young
J. Smith
C. Evans
D. Douse
J. Camp

With "roster management" a hot topic, and recruiting numbers looking good with more projected to commit, how do you guys think we'll look at using freshman, and preserving redshirts going forward? Also, we have three seniors (Cooper, Lee, Camp) who can redshirt and preserve another year of eligibility. I'm not sure where they stand academically, but they may finish school and not want to play more football. This may depend on if they can get accepted to grad school at GT.
 
I say forget it. If they can play, get them on the field. Getting as much experience as possible now will pay dividends in the coming seasons.
 
cyclejacket said:
...

With "roster management" a hot topic, and recruiting numbers looking good with more projected to commit, how do you guys think we'll look at using freshman, and preserving redshirts going forward? Also, we have three seniors (Cooper, Lee, Camp) who can redshirt and preserve another year of eligibility. I'm not sure where they stand academically, but they may finish school and not want to play more football. This may depend on if they can get accepted to grad school at GT.
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I sometimes wonder why guys who have difficulty getting into grad school don't consider a dual degree path. There are probably some NCAA rules that make that more complicated than I would expect.
 
Nazir Burnett has already entered the transfer portal. This was a few weeks ago.
 
I'm kind of surprised Kalani Norris has played this much. It seems like we've got plenty of WR talent, and it's not like we're slinging the ball all over the place to warrant needing 6+ receivers.
 
D Leonard is a preferred walk on. Smart kid (Ivy League was interested). But he’s a tweener size/speed wise between TE and receiver. Had 3 straight TD games at Milton with Yates throwing to him.

Curious to see how the roster management piece works out.
 
aeromech said:
I sometimes wonder why guys who have difficulty getting into grad school don't consider a dual degree path. There are probably some NCAA rules that make that more complicated than I would expect.
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You're not allowed to take the same degree/classes you already took. You have to stay on a degree path. It's harder for the SAs at Tech. If you already hopped on the M train, that leaves with a relatively hard path.
 
Techbert said:
This.

And if you tell the kids you play if you earn it, you have to play them when they earn it.

We don't need to preserve redshirts. Our recruiting is on the upswing.
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That's true, but it's also true that a 5th year senior is almost always better than a true freshman.

If they can help us on the field right now, then they should play. Otherwise, give them their 4 games and reset the clock for next year. There are plenty of guys who are not at all ready to contribute as true freshmen that turn out to be ballers by their senior year.
 
Wonder if Yates will start challenging Graham for the starting job.

Next year that is.
 
cyclejacket said:
------------------------------
K. Norris: 4 games
J. Huff: 3 games
K. Johnson: 2 games
N. Burnett: 2 games
W. Walker: 1 game
J. Yates: 1 game
==================
Click to expand...

I'm most interested in this middle section from the OP. I don't think any of the lower section are at risk of burning their redshirt with realistically only 5 games remaining. Likely going to be hard to keep a shirt on Norris and Huff. You would have to shut down Norris, and that isn't happening barring an injury. We do have 3 WR commits, plus Ezzard for 2020...so not a major issue in my opinion to burn Norris' shirt as long as he is getting valuable reps on offense or ST. Huff also likely burns his shirt. He is in the CB position group that has only 4 players currently ATL. I'm sure he is getting reps on ST and was at one point ATL at WR. His shirt likely burns.

I see everyone else as safe. Kenan Johnson was ATL to start the year, but is currently not. That is likely some RS preservation at work by the coaches. The coaches should be able to manage around Walker's red-shirt with 3 games available to play and only 5 remaining. No need to burns Yates' shirt with Graham capably playing 100% of the game reps.

From the lower section, it would be nice to see one of the 3 DL (Lockhart, Camp, Douse) to get ATL down the stretch and crack the rotation. I would not advocate burning their RS, but actual game reps would help their development. DL is a clearly position group where we need to continue to build depth, and hopefully find a disruptor either internally or externally prior to 2020.
 
johncu said:
That's true, but it's also true that a 5th year senior is almost always better than a true freshman.

If they can help us on the field right now, then they should play. Otherwise, give them their 4 games and reset the clock for next year. There are plenty of guys who are not at all ready to contribute as true freshmen that turn out to be ballers by their senior year.
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I think the 5th year senior argument held more water under the previous regime. I think we’re gonna be a bit more “cutthroat” when it comes to renewing schollies under CGC. Meaning more turnover year to year so might as well play whoever can help in any situation because who knows what the roster will look like 2/3 years down the line.
 
With three more seasons left for these players, we may end up red-shirting them later for an injury. If they can contribute, they should play.
 
gtrower said:
I think the 5th year senior argument held more water under the previous regime. I think we’re gonna be a bit more “cutthroat” when it comes to renewing schollies under CGC. Meaning more turnover year to year so might as well play whoever can help in any situation because who knows what the roster will look like 2/3 years down the line.
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I think there's a middle ground somewhere that we can find. Hopefully we can start recruiting more impact freshmen that can be stars from Day 1, but even if only in terms of depth, having 5th year seniors is extremely valuable. Imagine if we had redshirted Josh Nesbitt, for example. 2011 would have been a COMPLETELY different season. Or imagine if we hadn't redshirted Justin Thomas. We'd probably have gone from 9-4 to missing a bowl game with sophomore TaQuon Marshall at QB.
 
JoeCakeEater said:
I'm most interested in this middle section from the OP. I don't think any of the lower section are at risk of burning their redshirt with realistically only 5 games remaining. Likely going to be hard to keep a shirt on Norris and Huff. You would have to shut down Norris, and that isn't happening barring an injury. We do have 3 WR commits, plus Ezzard for 2020...so not a major issue in my opinion to burn Norris' shirt as long as he is getting valuable reps on offense or ST. Huff also likely burns his shirt. He is in the CB position group that has only 4 players currently ATL. I'm sure he is getting reps on ST and was at one point ATL at WR. His shirt likely burns.
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Norris is a tough one for me to understand. He played in our first 2 games, then didn't play the next three, but has played in the last 2. I can't recall seeing him on the field much and for sure don't recall any targets to him. Maybe he's playing more on ST? Seems odd to burn the shirt on a Freshman that's only getting a few snaps here and there. Or maybe he's out there more than I see but just don't notice him because he isn't being targeted?
 
  1. I wonder if this wasn't a conscious effort to play them so that they get experience not only for this year but also for next
  2. It is a fact that we have very few SRs and not really that many JRs so there wasn't a lot of choice
  3. Now, Collins says playing a lot of people is his philosophy so this might not be anything "special". It might be the way we will always play. Red-shirting may be a secondary concern where for most of the last 20 years it was a primary concern for freshmen at GT.
 
johncu said:
I think there's a middle ground somewhere that we can find. Hopefully we can start recruiting more impact freshmen that can be stars from Day 1, but even if only in terms of depth, having 5th year seniors is extremely valuable. Imagine if we had redshirted Josh Nesbitt, for example. 2011 would have been a COMPLETELY different season. Or imagine if we hadn't redshirted Justin Thomas. We'd probably have gone from 9-4 to missing a bowl game with sophomore TaQuon Marshall at QB.
Click to expand...

Yeah but that’s kind of what I’m getting at - it made more sense with CPJs offense. JT5 was a monster in our offense but wasn’t gonna be drafted early no matter how well he played. So the 5th year was a lock. Similar things could be said for most of the offensive positions. If I’m not mistaken we didn’t have a single offensive player drafted early since 2009. So getting those 5th years was more of a reality. To the point where you might risk putting in a worse player into a game to maintain a RS for another player.

With a more conventional offense these guys that are good enough for us to want to keep around are more likely to leave early anyway. And with more “roster management” you’re less likely to have a guy for 5 years anyway. I don’t think there should be many scenarios under CGC where we decide to play a worse option to maintain a RS.

So just be smart about it. Don’t throw a guy in for garbage time in 5 games. But if somebody can give you meaningful snaps - even just a few - in some games, then get him on the field. That’s what I say at least.
 
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