How in the name of God do you leave JD off this list?!

If they put Dwyer on this list, I'm sure message boards from the candidate who got knocked off would have this same exact thread. I'm also sure that there are other boards out there with this thread right now. Every above average team thinks that their best player is a dark horse Heisman candidate.
 
I love the inclusion of Jimmy Clausen on not one, but two lists. Because last year's11/22 41 yard, 2 pic masterpiece in Southern California was the stuff that a real Heisman candidate is made of. These people make Lou Holtz look intelligent. I cannot wait for ND to crash and burn.
 
But Jimmy Clausen...seriously...what kind of logic is that? What has he done to warrant any Heisman discussion at all besides having a famous last name?


Edit: Beat me to it lol
 
gth816f said:
If they put Dwyer on this list, I'm sure message boards from the candidate who got knocked off would have this same exact thread. I'm also sure that there are other boards out there with this thread right now. Every above average team thinks that their best player is a dark horse Heisman candidate.
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While true...those teams probably aren't boasting the Conference player of the year with 1300+yds rushing and 12 TDs.
 
He's ranked near the top 5 in both total yards and ypc of those returning this year. Very few others can boast that. Other teams may complain, but leaving him off is a legitimate oversight.
 
yellowandnaked said:
But Jimmy Clausen...seriously...what kind of logic is that? What has he done to warrant any Heisman discussion at all besides having a famous last name?


Edit: Beat me to it lol
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I'm sorry, are you under some illusion that the Heisman isn't a popularity/fame contest? We might not like it, but it would be a mistake not to factor in name recognition and the school the player plays for when making any Heisman predictions. Not to mention the position. These people aren't being asked to predict the best player in the nation next year; they're being asked to predict who's going to win the Heisman. An upperclassman Notre Dame quarterback should always be included on a dark horse Heisman candidate list.
 
gth816f said:
I'm sorry, are you under some illusion that the Heisman isn't a popularity/fame contest? We might not like it, but it would be a mistake not to factor in name recognition and the school the player plays for when making any Heisman predictions. Not to mention the position. These people aren't being asked to predict the best player in the nation next year; they're being asked to predict who's going to win the Heisman.
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I can agree with you on that. And no, I'm not under any illusion but thanks for asking. Obviously, name recognition must play some small part.
 
gth816f said:
I'm sorry, are you under some illusion that the Heisman isn't a popularity/fame contest? We might not like it, but it would be a mistake not to factor in name recognition and the school the player plays for when making any Heisman predictions. Not to mention the position. These people aren't being asked to predict the best player in the nation next year; they're being asked to predict who's going to win the Heisman. An upperclassman Notre Dame quarterback should always be included on a dark horse Heisman candidate list.
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Well stated. Who was the db who was awarded the Heisman over Peyton Manning? :rolleyes:
 
augustabuzz said:
Well stated. Who was the db who was awarded the Heisman over Peyton Manning? :rolleyes:
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Yes, point to the only year in the history of the Heisman award that a defensive player won it as evidence against the fact that the Heisman award is a popularity contest and having a big name and going to a famous school doesn't give you a huge leg up.

Every other week in here we have posts about how certain schools get favored in the polls because of their names and histories. Hell, there is one about Notre Dame(Clausen's school) on our front page right now. What makes you think that same bias doesn't carry over to Heisman voting?
 
I think JD is under the radar for a few reasons. Most of the "experts" have not really seen him play and don't understand how special he is. They discount his stats based on the notion that we have a running offense and our backs will always put up big numbers. As a sophomore who was unknown until this year, they haven't been talking about him long enough. And GT is not a consistent top ten team yet, and they don't expect Heisman candidates to come from there. We have important games on Thursday nights in September. If he does what I think he'll do, he'll be on everyone's list.
 
The less hype for him the better. We know how special JD is. Hey maybe with less hype his draft stock won't be great. One can dream can't they?
 
There is no damned way Jimmy Clausen should be anywhere near one of those lists.

Of course, the Heisman is voted on and we have an ex-ACORN street thug in the White House and I didn't think people would be that stupid either.
 
gt23eric said:
The less hype for him the better. We know how special JD is. Hey maybe with less hype his draft stock won't be great. One can dream can't they?
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Yes, that would be nice. Maybe this season he can help GT return to national prominence and really build his name, so that he's on Heisman lists for his senior season. Best of both worlds.
 
Ironically, ESPN.com's main page story mentions ND as a national title contender. These are the types of people voting on the Heisman, and why Jimmy Clausen is considered a dark horse candidate.
 
I would bet our bowl game performance is affecting some of these preseason Heisman lists. If we get good offensive line play this year, GT will gets lots of national exposure, JD will get losts of stats and exponsure, and things will take care of itself. If the offensive line play is mediocre; well, then there is always his senior year to look forward too.
 
augustabuzz said:
Well stated. Who was the db who was awarded the Heisman over Peyton Manning? :rolleyes:
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If I recall, the Manning name got Peyton some negative votes, and voters opted for Michigan's top player, who being a DB was not as good a player as (and I hate saying this) Champ Bailey that year. So yes, I agree with gth816f, the Heisman is as much about politics as it is playing ability.
 
aeromech said:
If I recall, the Manning name got Peyton some negative votes, and voters opted for Michigan's top player, who being a DB was not as good a player as (and I hate saying this) Champ Bailey that year. So yes, I agree with gth816f, the Heisman is as much about politics as it is playing ability.
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Thanks for confirming my point. Woodson was awarded the Heisman because he played for Michigan. Was Ron Dayne a better player than Joe Hamilton in '99? NO! But, he did play in the default conference.
 
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