To win the division...?

ChoicesApprentice#21

ChoicesApprentice#21

Flats Noob
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
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So someone tell me this? If we beat Va Tech we win our division? Of course I realize we have to beat VA, Duke, Wake, and FSU. BUT say we lose to FSU and beat all the rest are we in? I know its thinking down the road but I don't understand to scenario, I thought we had to basically run the table in our ACC games?
 
My understanding is that we would need to win out and also have Miami lose one more game to have a chance. There is a thread over on the Hive that goes into greater detail but we basically would lose any tie breaker scenario that involves Miami even if it were to be three way tie.
 
GTPilot got it...I believe.

Miami's gotta drop another one b/c they beat us head to head, and we have to win out.

Of course who knows what will happen...it could come down to another 3 way tie b/w three 3 loss teams again.
 
It is way too early in the season to know. VT, UVa, and Duke control their own destiny. Obviously, only VT is playing well enough to run through undefeated.

UNC, Miami, and GT all need some kind of help to win the division. If I was guessing, I would say that the division winner is going to be 6-2. The only thing we can do to help ourselves is win.
 
Miami's gotta drop another one b/c they beat us head to head, and we have to win out.
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If we beat VT, and VT beat Miami, and Miami beat us, then head-to-heads neutral out. If all of us beat the rest of the Coastal, then that tiebreaker fails as well, and we'd be back to the BCS formula to determine the entrant to the ACCCG, which would be calculated AFTER we play Georgia at home. It's possible, though not likely, that whipping Georgia as badly as possible may be required to get us to the ACC Championship Game. :)

If we beat VT and all three of us have one other loss to an Atlantic team, the same sort of situation emerges, where the tiebreakers all fail and it reverts to BCS rank.

GTPilot said:
My understanding is that we would need to win out and also have Miami lose one more game to have a chance. There is a thread over on the Hive that goes into greater detail but we basically would lose any tie breaker scenario that involves Miami even if it were to be three way tie.
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Depends on Miami's out of conference wins, truth be told. If they get crushed by Oklahoma they might drop behind us in the BCS, which is the ultimate tiebreaker if ACC record and head-to-heads are even.

If we go undefeated from here on out, and they pick up another OOC loss and go undefeated for the remainder of ACC play, then VT and Miami will both be 2 loss teams to our 1 loss, and we'll be ranked higher than them in the BCS formula by way of voters and computer rankings. We still control our own destiny at this point.
 
If we go 6-2 like you are suggesting, with a win over Va Tech and a loss to FSU, we are more than likely going to have to win a tiebreaker to get to the ACCCG.

The two biggest hurdles, of course, will be Va Tech and Miami. Miami's remaining conference schedule, in order of hardest to easiest (IMO) includes: @UNC, Clemson, @Wake, UVA, Duke.

Check out Va Tech's hilarious joke of a conference sched excluding their game with us: UNC, BC, NCSt, @Maryland, @Duke, @UVA.

Given their schedules, it seems to me that it's equally unlikely that Miami will go to 5-3 or that Va Tech will go to 6-2. If lightning strikes and both those things happen, we'd win any tie-breaker scenario, either head-to-head or with multiple teams.

If we get to a 3-way tie with Va Tech and Miami, with each team being 6-2, and with each having both a win and a loss against the other two, then it will come down to who has the best record against Coastal teams. In your scenario, we'd be 4-1 in the Coastal and thus could not be eliminated by that rule. Ideally, Miami would have lost to UNC, eliminating Miami and getting us to a head-to-head with Va Tech and/or UNC, which we win.

Beyond that, it's pretty complicated and can have to do with overall schedules and even BCS ranking.

Bottom line: It's really gonna be tough for us to win the conference at 6-2. Our best hope to win at 6-2 would be for Miami to implode all the way down to 5-3 and for Va Tech to get stunningly upset by someone, and that's assuming we beat them.

Given the Hokies' joke of a schedule, it is not an overstatement to say that if we don't beat Va Tech, we have almost zero chance.
 
Bottom line: They have to revamp who is in which division. The Coastal is way too stacked. Move VT and UNC to the Atlantic in exchange for BC and WF, then things become extremely interesting in football and basketball.

Currently the Coastal has:

Football Superiors:
1. VT
2. GT
3. Miami
4. UNC

Basketball Superiors:
1. UNC
2. Duke

Guys had to be on crack when they were making these divisions.
 
In hindsight, maybe I am underestimating the chances that Va Tech loses to one of those lesser conference opponents. @UVA, @Duke and @Maryland are such hilarious jokes that they could get trapped by one of em, I guess. I wouldn't bet on it though.
 
GiveEmHellJackets said:
In hindsight, maybe I am underestimating the chances that Va Tech loses to one of those lesser conference opponents. @UVA, @Duke and @Maryland are such hilarious jokes that they could get trapped by one of em, I guess. I wouldn't bet on it though.
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If Taylor gets hurt for one of them, it is possible.
 
Miami will lose to Oklahoma which means they drop. If they don't win convincingly and/or lose and we play well we will be ranked in front as long as we beat VT and @FSU. Those are the main games that I have circled.
 
cajunjacket said:
Bottom line: They have to revamp who is in which division. The Coastal is way too stacked. Move VT and UNC to the Atlantic in exchange for BC and WF, then things become extremely interesting in football and basketball.

Currently the Coastal has:

Football Superiors:
1. VT
2. GT
3. Miami
4. UNC

Basketball Superiors:
1. UNC
2. Duke

Guys had to be on crack when they were making these divisions.
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I really think divisions is a model that doesnt work for the ACC. Too spread out, too many changes from year to year on power, etc. I think we should go to a full rotating schedule. Keep the "rival" part if you want (I'd dislike not playing clemson for a year or two at a time).

Put the teams with the best record in the championship game.
 
RamblinPeck said:
I really think divisions is a model that doesnt work for the ACC. Too spread out, too many changes from year to year on power, etc. I think we should go to a full rotating schedule. Keep the "rival" part if you want (I'd dislike not playing clemson for a year or two at a time).

Put the teams with the best record in the championship game.
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I agree, plus play the Championship game at the Highest Ranked Teams' site the first year. The second year play it at the highestranked team unless the other team is within 5 or 10 slots AND the previous game was at the highest ranked. Then play it at the second ranked.
 
RamblinPeck said:
I really think divisions is a model that doesnt work for the ACC. Too spread out, too many changes from year to year on power, etc. I think we should go to a full rotating schedule. Keep the "rival" part if you want (I'd dislike not playing clemson for a year or two at a time).

Put the teams with the best record in the championship game.
Click to expand...

I was actually thinking about this yesterday. If we were to realign divisions, I'd say just move us to the Atlantic, and send Maryland over to the Coastal. That would balance out the strength in football with the Atlantic having f$u, Tech, and climpsun as the three forerunners. Then the Coastal would have VT, miami, and unc, with maryland capable of popping up from time to time.

On top of that, set our yearly inter-division matchup to vt. This establishes a rivalry between f$u, and makes our rivalry with climpsun even more important. Plus, I just like playing vt every year. They're the king of the hill right now, so I want us to beat them every year.

To be completely honest, though, I really favor the round-robin schedule. I'd love to see that.
 
cajunjacket said:
Bottom line: They have to revamp who is in which division. The Coastal is way too stacked. Move VT and UNC to the Atlantic in exchange for BC and WF, then things become extremely interesting in football and basketball.

Currently the Coastal has:

Football Superiors:
1. VT
2. GT
3. Miami
4. UNC

Basketball Superiors:
1. UNC
2. Duke

Guys had to be on crack when they were making these divisions.
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i dont think there are any "divisions" in basketball, are there?
 
This is how it goes. If both us and Miami are tied at the end of the season, we screwed they go.

If it is a three way tie with VPI in there and we all own the head to head over each other, and none of us has any more coastal losses, the decider is non-divisonal record. Because we're assuming a 7-1 conference record then the record against Atlantic teams is tied as well. So from there the decider is non-conference record.VPI is already down in that cause of Bama. If Miami loses next weak and has a OOC loss then we control our own destiny as long as VPI doesn't drop an ACC game to someone other than us.
 
cajunjacket said:
Bottom line: They have to revamp who is in which division. The Coastal is way too stacked. Move VT and UNC to the Atlantic in exchange for BC and WF, then things become extremely interesting in football and basketball.

Currently the Coastal has:

Football Superiors:
1. VT
2. GT
3. Miami
4. UNC

Basketball Superiors:
1. UNC
2. Duke

Guys had to be on crack when they were making these divisions.
Click to expand...
Can't realign the divisions just because one is better than the other for a period of time.
 
cajunjacket said:
Bottom line: They have to revamp who is in which division. The Coastal is way too stacked. Move VT and UNC to the Atlantic in exchange for BC and WF, then things become extremely interesting in football and basketball.

Currently the Coastal has:

Football Superiors:
1. VT
2. GT
3. Miami
4. UNC

Basketball Superiors:
1. UNC
2. Duke

Guys had to be on crack when they were making these divisions.
Click to expand...

In your "football superiors" section, I fail to see how UNC is better than Clemson or Wake. I actually think the conferences are pretty balanced. VT has been one of the most consistent teams in the country the past 10 years, and I would venture to say that FSU has been more consistent than us in the past many years. If you give us credit for having 6-6 and 7-6 seasons, you should give FSU credit too!

Boston College always gets underrated as well, but there record has been better than ours over the past 5-6 years. Lumping us and UNC in as "superiors" just doesn't ring true, ultimately.

You're talking about this year, but when I was in grad school at UNC during the '02 and '03 seasons, they didn't win a single game in home in two years. Duke beat them at Kenan. UNC has done squat since the 90's.
 
BuzzCzar said:
i dont think there are any "divisions" in basketball, are there?
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Good question. I know that the tournament isn't affected by it. Maybe it affects who you play in reg season multiple times. I don't know.

TechPhi97 said:
In your "football superiors" section, I fail to see how UNC is better than Clemson or Wake. I actually think the conferences are pretty balanced. VT has been one of the most consistent teams in the country the past 10 years, and I would venture to say that FSU has been more consistent than us in the past many years. If you give us credit for having 6-6 and 7-6 seasons, you should give FSU credit too!

Boston College always gets underrated as well, but there record has been better than ours over the past 5-6 years. Lumping us and UNC in as "superiors" just doesn't ring true, ultimately.

You're talking about this year, but when I was in grad school at UNC during the '02 and '03 seasons, they didn't win a single game in home in two years. Duke beat them at Kenan. UNC has done squat since the 90's.
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OK, so scratch UNC and GT. Then you still have historically good VT and Miami vs. only one historically good FSU team. Any way you slice it, the divisions are not split correctly.

Maybe the best way is doing what a previous poster said and just take the two best records. Do away with the divisions. The names of the divisions are confusing enough to keep up with.
 
One thing to keep in mind - if there is a 3-way tie and the tiebreak falls to the BCS rank then it's not simply who has the highest BCS rank. If the second team in that tiebreak is within 5 spots, then the head-to-head record of those two teams is used to determine the divisional representative. Gotta hope UM loses atleast one more ACC game and we take care o' bidness.
 
Enuratique said:
One thing to keep in mind - if there is a 3-way tie and the tiebreak falls to the BCS rank then it's not simply who has the highest BCS rank. If the second team in that tiebreak is within 5 spots, then the head-to-head record of those two teams is used to determine the divisional representative. Gotta hope UM loses atleast one more ACC game and we take care o' bidness.
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Damn. What kind of BS is that?? :laugher::laugher::laugher:

5 spots??

ACC is one of the most geeked up leagues out there. Regardless, we are in control of our destiny once again, thanks to VT. If we win the rest of our games, we WILL go to the ACC championship. That's a great feeling.
 
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