We are a Service Academy.

The Machine said:
During the last 25 years, we were only successful when we ran a service academy offense with a service academy coach. How long will you wait before you accept that this is where we are?
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Your last post was about Daryl Richard?? Thanks for coming out.
 
USCJacket said:
You cherry picked this and you’re still wrong.

The last almost decade has been the same rinse and repeat with Alabama, Clemson, tOSU, OU, LSU and newcomers Michigan and that team in Athens.
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You called me wrong and then made the exact same point.

I didn't cherry pick anything, I took the year 2006 where the SEC started owning the national championship and then gave examples using the immediate prior 10 years.

I also didn't say I oppose NIL. My point is I don't think GT will be a power player even though they have the resources. Going back to Dave Braine football has been an afterthought.
 
I seem to recall the rules around APR making a big difference in the ability to hide players
 
USCJacket said:
Ummmm 25 years ago GT had Joe Hamilton followed by Godsey running the O at QB. Last I checked, GT was successful not running the 3O during that time. Galley’s O was boring at times, but again GT was successful.
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Completely different time. Back then good football players still committed to colleges in part to get a good education. Now it’s all about the NFL. Back, then it was illegal to pay players. Very few schools were allowed to get away with it. Back then players were committed to a team. They couldn’t enter a transfer portal and bar-hop from program to program looking for their perfect fit.
 
BeeStorm said:
Gailey lost 5 games every year... your measurement of success is sus.
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This. The Gailey-Tenuta years were actually really nice in hindsight. Consistent bowl appearances. Some great RBs and WRs and some very good defenses.
 
The Machine said:
During the last 25 years, we were only successful when we ran a service academy offense with a service academy coach. How long will you wait before you accept that this is where we are?
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There is a lot of truth right there. To be honest outside of the 1990 Season CPJ era was the most successful since Coach Bobby Dodd graced our sidelines. The problem is that CPJ was 1-3 in Title games and 1-2 in the OB. People liked the success, however they immediately assumed that the Yellow Jackets were being held back because of the 3TO.

Once that happened it made it impossible for GTAA, Boosters and fans to appreciate what the 3TO did for us. It also laid the ground work for GT to once again look like a the team from the eighties. (GT only won 43 games over the 10 years in the 1980s/4.3 Wins on avg)

The issue isn't as simple as just hiring Jeff Monken. (While he would be a better HC then Clown or Key) as the new rules on 3TO would prevent us from running the exact same flexbone scheme we saw in the Paul Johnson era. We would need to run a version of it like Willie Fritz or Jamey Chadwell do.

All that being said you are correct that Georgia Tech's most success post Bobby Dodd era outside of the 1990 season came during the Paul Johnson era. Our current problem is the fact that, "The Key hire " was made by a collection of people and Good Old Boy culture who overruled the new AD (J Batt) behind closed doors, enamored by 8 weeks and the fact that he was “one of us.” We could have had Jamey Chadwell or Willie Fritz. IIWII
 
Tampa Jacket said:
Completely different time. Back then good football players still committed to colleges in part to get a good education. Now it’s all about the NFL. Back, then it was illegal to pay players. Very few schools were allowed to get away with it. Back then players were committed to a team. They couldn’t enter a transfer portal and bar-hop from program to program looking for their perfect fit.
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Don’t be naive here. The goal has always been to go to the NFL. You think that mindset has magically just changed? Since probably late 70’s early 80’s kids have largely picked a school for the coach 1, school 2. FSU (Bowden), Nebraska (Osbourne), PSU (Paterno) are all perfect examples.

Add in the other factor in this all, getting paid under the table by boosters is nothing new, other than it’s legal to do so now using the NIL collective.

People always act like the game was “perfect” until NIL and the Portal came along, all while forgetting tampering, paying players, etc has always been there.

And FWIW, there is nothing wrong with a kid going to a different school. It’s no different than any other general student. They can transfer from school to school (I did) so why can’t a SA? Kids want to win and get the best shot at living out their dream, so why does that make you so upset? Coaches do the same thing going from job to job. It’s a part of life.
 
GTFLETCH said:
There is a lot of truth right there. To be honest outside of the 1990 Season CPJ era was the most successful since Coach Bobby Dodd graced our sidelines. The problem is that CPJ was 1-3 in Title games and 1-2 in the OB. People liked the success, however they immediately assumed that the Yellow Jackets were being held back because of the 3TO.

Once that happened it made it impossible for GTAA, Boosters and fans to appreciate what the 3TO did for us. It also laid the ground work for GT to once again look like a the team from the eighties. (GT only won 43 games over the 10 years in the 1980s/4.3 Wins on avg)

The issue isn't as simple as just hiring Jeff Monken. (While he would be a better HC then Clown or Key) as the new rules on 3TO would prevent us from running the exact same flexbone scheme we saw in the Paul Johnson era. We would need to run a version of it like Willie Fritz or Jamey Chadwell do.

All that being said you are correct that Georgia Tech's most success post Bobby Dodd era outside of the 1990 season came during the Paul Johnson era. Our current problem is the fact that, "The Key hire " was made by a collection of people and Good Old Boy culture who overruled the new AD (J Batt) behind closed doors, enamored by 8 weeks and the fact that he was “one of us.” We could have had Jamey Chadwell or Willie Fritz. IIWII
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I'm still hopeful that we can still get Chadwell from Liberty in a couple of years if the wheels fall off the Key bus.
 
USCJacket said:
Ummmm 25 years ago GT had Joe Hamilton followed by Godsey running the O at QB. Last I checked, GT was successful not running the 3O during that time. Galley’s O was boring at times, but again GT was successful.
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I agree with you USCJacket, we are not a service academy. Unfortunately the program has struggled mightily transitioning from the TO. We had some fine years under CPJ going to Orange, Gator, and Peach Bowls, but we are paying a pretty stiff price for that success. In hindsight what Tech needed to do when CPJ retired was to come up with the money to hire a well known, proven head coach who could attract HS athletes. I know what you are thinking which is where do we get the money? Tech would have had to start some kind of fund raising campaign to hire a top notch staff and if the alumni and fans did not respond then Tech does not deserve a Top 25 football program. We’ll see if this AD can stir up the alumni and fans to step up and bring Tech back to the years we had under O’Leary & Ross. No doubt it can be done, it’s been done before … we’ll see.
 
USCJacket said:
Ummmm 25 years ago GT had Joe Hamilton followed by Godsey running the O at QB. Last I checked, GT was successful not running the 3O during that time. Galley’s O was boring at times, but again GT was successful.
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agree in one sense, we could compete with most teams ( 51-7 losses to both VT and Jawja hyever), and that Wake ACCC loss were not pretty. But other than those, we were fairly well coached and had players. Success maybe more mediocrity, but nothing like this last 5 seasons
 
USCJacket said:
Don’t be naive here. The goal has always been to go to the NFL. You think that mindset has magically just changed? Since probably late 70’s early 80’s kids have largely picked a school for the coach 1, school 2. FSU (Bowden), Nebraska (Osbourne), PSU (Paterno) are all perfect examples.

Add in the other factor in this all, getting paid under the table by boosters is nothing new, other than it’s legal to do so now using the NIL collective.

People always act like the game was “perfect” until NIL and the Portal came along, all while forgetting tampering, paying players, etc has always been there.

And FWIW, there is nothing wrong with a kid going to a different school. It’s no different than any other general student. They can transfer from school to school (I did) so why can’t a SA? Kids want to win and get the best shot at living out their dream, so why does that make you so upset? Coaches do the same thing going from job to job. It’s a part of life.
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So tell me… How did UGA win back to back national championships, after almost a 1/2 century?

Is that a statistical normalcy?

You bring up Nebraska. Why are they irrelevant now?

You think this is business as usual? Enjoy your fantasy.
 
Tampa Jacket said:
So tell me… How did UGA win back to back national championships, after almost a 1/2 century?

Is that a statistical normalcy?

You bring up Nebraska. Why are they irrelevant now?

You think this is business as usual? Enjoy your fantasy.
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Come on already….

It’s not 1980-2000 anymore. The state of Georgia and metro Atlanta in general has doubled in size since 2000. UGA has a much bigger recruiting talent pool in the state of Georgia alone vs even 20 years ago. Outside of Oregon, tOSU, Texas, Alabama, USC, Clemson no one is on the same level as far as budget and resources at their disposal. Do you disagree?

Look at the amount of players tOSU, Michigan, Clemson, Alabama, UGA, LSU send to the NFL now. Do you think that’s coincidence to the rise of Clemson, UGA?

Flip side for Nebraska. That state produces very little P5 talent. When Nebraska had it rolling under Osbourne, they could go into Texas and Oklahoma and land pretty much whoever they wanted. Facilities, etc didn’t mean as much to kids then as it does now. That’s the biggest change in CFB.

The game itself from a resources, facilities and revenue perspective has exploded. It’s all about the arms race. Miami and FSU have realized this and are quickly investing.

So back to Nebraska, who sells out every week, but they don’t produce the revenue from merch sales etc like tOSU, Michigan, Texas, UGA, etc.

The biggest impact is the game isn’t regional anymore. It’s not about staying geographically in the conference you grew up seeing on TV. This is another factor that will continue to keep Nebraska down. They have lost that “IT” factor as the game exploded and evolved with TV coverage.

Being on “national TV” on a Thursday night, Saturday afternoon has become a thing of the past. Simply because EVERY game is nationally televised. Also, all programs recruit nationally more so now than ever. Kids from California that may have been locks to USC, UCLA at one time, are going to tOSU, Alabama, Clemson, UGA, etc. Bryce Young was committed to USC at one point as an example.
 
BeeStorm said:
bowl should be in quotes.
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If they’re playing them, we ought to be in one. If there are too many of them then we damn sure ought to be in one.

I’ve never understood the “those bowl appearances don’t count because there are too many bowls” logic. Even with too many bowls, at one point we were in the top four in the country for consecutive bowl appearances, above any number of football factories. If it’s so easy to get in one, why are we now looking at a 5 year drought?

JRjr
 
GoldenIsle said:
I agree with you USCJacket, we are not a service academy. Unfortunately the program has struggled mightily transitioning from the TO. We had some fine years under CPJ going to Orange, Gator, and Peach Bowls, but we are paying a pretty stiff price for that success. In hindsight what Tech needed to do when CPJ retired was to come up with the money to hire a well known, proven head coach who could attract HS athletes. I know what you are thinking which is where do we get the money? Tech would have had to start some kind of fund raising campaign to hire a top notch staff and if the alumni and fans did not respond then Tech does not deserve a Top 25 football program. We’ll see if this AD can stir up the alumni and fans to step up and bring Tech back to the years we had under O’Leary & Ross. No doubt it can be done, it’s been done before … we’ll see.
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Or we could’ve maintained our identity as an option team and continued to build something. Ah well. I wasn’t in charge.
 
USCJacket said:
Come on already….

It’s not 1980-2000 anymore. The state of Georgia and metro Atlanta in general has doubled in size since 2000. UGA has a much bigger recruiting talent pool in the state of Georgia alone vs even 20 years ago. Outside of Oregon, tOSU, Texas, Alabama, USC, Clemson no one is on the same level as far as budget and resources at their disposal. Do you disagree?

Look at the amount of players tOSU, Michigan, Clemson, Alabama, UGA, LSU send to the NFL now. Do you think that’s coincidence to the rise of Clemson, UGA?

Flip side for Nebraska. That state produces very little P5 talent. When Nebraska had it rolling under Osbourne, they could go into Texas and Oklahoma and land pretty much whoever they wanted. Facilities, etc didn’t mean as much to kids then as it does now. That’s the biggest change in CFB.

The game itself from a resources, facilities and revenue perspective has exploded. It’s all about the arms race. Miami and FSU have realized this and are quickly investing.

So back to Nebraska, who sells out every week, but they don’t produce the revenue from merch sales etc like tOSU, Michigan, Texas, UGA, etc.

The biggest impact is the game isn’t regional anymore. It’s not about staying geographically in the conference you grew up seeing on TV. This is another factor that will continue to keep Nebraska down. They have lost that “IT” factor as the game exploded and evolved with TV coverage.

Being on “national TV” on a Thursday night, Saturday afternoon has become a thing of the past. Simply because EVERY game is nationally televised. Also, all programs recruit nationally more so now than ever. Kids from California that may have been locks to USC, UCLA at one time, are going to tOSU, Alabama, Clemson, UGA, etc. Bryce Young was committed to USC at one point as an example.
Click to expand...

Nebraska was one of the first “facilities” universities. Their weight lifting program was legendary. Eventually other factories copied it.

Nebraska also had an advantage they no longer enjoy. Every high school in Nebraska ran the Nebraska power-I. Those linemen weren’t learning an offense, they were gaining weight. Go to TX and grab some skill players and profit.
 
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