Discussion in 'Football' started by thegtstunner08, Feb 7, 2019.
Did Coach O’Leary ever lose to Duke?
Did he ever play a bowl eligible Duke?
I bet it eats you up inside that O'leary never won the Orange Bowl or had a team finish ranked in the top 10. O'leary will always have the "couldn't beat FSU" banner hanging around his neck. Did Johnson have an annual rival that he never beat? The ACC is a much better football conference today than what it was back during O'leary's years; Georgia wasn't a top 10 team and neither was Clemson, Duke was nearly the worst team in the major college football.
Me thinks thou doest protest too much.
I don't know what you're smoking, and I'm not really on either side of who's better because it's a dumb hypothetical that you can never prove when they don't/didn't face the same teams/coaches. That said, the FSU and Miami teams that O'Leary coached against are mere ghosts of the programs they were then, and he never coached against VT. That's almost the same as making the argument that Bill Curry was the best GT coach ever because he went 2-3 vs Alabama.
Well, he didn't coach against Miami either. FSU did win an mnc in 2013. UNC and UVA were probably better then
Yes he did, he lost to Miami in the Gator Bowl. The only tough team he had to beat was FSU, UNC was post Mack Brown and in the terrible Carl Torbush years, UVA was at the end of Geoge Welsh with a couple of 7-5 & 6-6 teams.
Everyone measures CPJ against how he did against the big 4: UGA, Miami, VT, Clemson; which is why I brought them up. For O'leary there was really just FSU; UGA was in the mediocre Donnan years, Clemson was stinking it up with Tommy West and Tommy Bowden. I liked O'leary; but he truly benefited from a much easier schedule than Gailey or Johnson. Like Johnson, O'leary was gruff with the press and didn't make many friends; neither was able to recruit very well. They were both very close; but if there is an edge it goes to Johnson.
I think Johnson went 3-2 against FSU with wins in 2008, 2009, 2015, and losses in 2012 & 2014. FSU won the ACC in 2012-2014 with a National Championship in 2013. While it is true that FSU is a dumpster fire right now, it wasn't when Johnson played them.
The O'Leary years were enjoyable but there is no question that the inability to beat FSU was frustrating. We mostly got boatraced by them, in fact. On the other hand, CPJ got some really big wins but would often have a couple of frustrating head-scratchers. I think they were pretty close, and people who give a clear edge to O'Leary probably just enjoyed his brand of football more, subjectively. Both good football coaches.
Didn't say it was a dumpster fire when CPJ coached here, I said it still wasn't the FSU of late 90's early 2000's.. Here is FSU's ranking for O'Leary's years the week it played us and final ranking for the year:
1995 - #1, finished #4
1996 - #3, finished #3
1997 - #3, finished #3
1998 - #6, finished #3
1999 - #1, finished #1
2000 - #2, finished #5
2001 - NR, finished #15
The years CPJ beat FSU they were ranked:
2008 - #16, finished #21
2009 - NR, finished NR
2015 - #9, finished #14
The years CPJ lost to FSU they were ranked:
2012 - #13, finished #10
2014 - #2, finished #5
We're getting boatraced by Clemson and UGAg right now, and those teams are the FSU of the late 90's.
We are. I was more thinking about to the 2008-2014 era. Clemson and uga have really taken off and now we have to deal with two powerhouses rather than the one O'Leary had to contend with.
Yeah, but PJ beat UGA once at least.
Yeah I was kinda touching on the fact that there wasn't a tremendous difference in GOL and CPJ, elite teams have boatraced us, yet when we were peaking we can play close with them. Here is one point I will make though: One of CPJ's best teams, the 2014 Orange Bowl champion team, played a #2 FSU very close in the ACCCG that year, and had a chance to win it. We could have slid into the playoffs but not sure, and the other point I'll make is FSU ended up finishing #5 that year. They were undefeated going into the playoffs at #2 but everyone knew they were the weakest team in the playoff. In 1999, FSU was ranked number #1, won the NC that year, and we lost to them by only 6 on the road. We played them closer on the road than VPI did in the national championship game at the Sugar Bowl. In 2000 they were #2 when we played them and lost by only 5 that year. So we did play them tough when we were at our best also in the GOL years. That 2014 CPJ team, I don't know that we could've hung with Ohio St., Oregon, or Bama.
Not when they were a top 5 team. The only year FSU wasn't was 2001 and that was the famous cancelled week of 9/11. We would've boat raced FSU that week.
Pretty well sums it up.
??? We got beat by Clemson, Maryland, Virginia, Georgia & FSU ( 17-28) later that year. People have accused me of either being drunk or smoking something in this thread so maybe I don't understand why you are confident we would have beat them that week.
The standard is top 5? What was UGA actually ranked?
PJ faced more top 25 teams than OLeary i think. Not positive, but would be interesting to check.
We were playing very well with a ton of momentum if you don't recall. We were ranked #10 and scheduled to play FSU the weekend after 9/11. They were top 10 also but highly overrated. As a matter of fact, the week after we were supposed to play them, they got boat raced by an unranked UNC team (that we beat).
I'm saying your argument was that CPJ beat UGAg at least once and GOL didn't beat FSU any. I'm saying UGAg wasn't ranked top 5 when we beat them. FSU was a top 5 team every single year we played them under GOL except that 2001 season.
They were aided by a bullshit PI call late in the game too iirc.