As more information is now becoming public

So you're saying it's a risk because any hire is a risk? Or it's a risk because you don't think PJ is a good coach? Because the later is what jacketup is saying.
 
<<<We see this year in and year out all over D-1 sports. The not-so-successful programs are always looking for mosses to come lead them and are willing to pay millions for a chance to have the new Messiah.>>>

Everybody does that. Look at Michigan, WV, Dook, L$U, F$U, UCLA, SMU and now maybe Bammer. All looking for the perfect coach this year! PJ was the least risky of the coaches on our list that we talked to (Muschamp, Cutcliffe, KY OC, Hatcher, Neuheisel, Strong).

It is safe to say that every hire has some element of rixk, just some more than others...
 
I know nothing about football, but I will guarantee you this: I can coach Michigan football to at least 8 wins every year. There is zero risk at Michigan regardless of hire. The conference is just too darn easy, add in a big house, etc. and there just won't be any risk involved.

Having said that, why would Michigan go with RR offense, when they can win with their current style? Just wait until that offense hits a few cold late fall days...

There is unusual risk involved because Michigan is going to recruit totally different players in the end.
 
Jacketup didn't say just 'risk', he said 'very risky' hire.

Every hire is risky of course, there are many factors. PJ's style and lack of BCS-conference-experience adds onto the risk but still his successful record this far and ties with GA compensates the risk. Overall, he is not 'very risky'.

To put it into more concrete terms, his option offense might not live up to the promise, but being a winner, he will recognize failures and correct for it.
 
cyptomcat said:
I agree partially with jacketup, PJ is not be a top notch coach YET, a petrino, rodriguez, miles, sabah, etc.
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That's a very skewed reality if Petrino, Rodriguez, and Saban are your 'Top Notch' coaches.

Saban was Chan-esque at Michigan State (6-5-1, 6-6, 7-5, 6-6, 10-2) and parlayed that into the LSU job (where he went 8-4, 10-3, 8-5, 13-1, 9-3), and finally 6-6 this year.

Rodriguez has done better, but against mostly Big Least competition. Most of that conference would struggle to win the SoCon regularly.

And the entire extent of Petrino's HC experience consists of 2 years in Conference USA and 2 years in the Big Least, using John L. Smith's players that were already coming off back-to-back conference titles.

As for Miles, his recruits are just now true juniors. He has 16 seniors at his 26 starting (O, D, and skill ST) positions. He was 16-16 at OSU before then.

I'll take my chances with CPJ, thank you very much.
 
Don't get me wrong, I'm a PJ lover, very excited about next season. I think he is an excellent fit for us and it will be exciting to see him with BCS-level talent.

On the other hand, if you don't think those coaches are top-notch though, you should go share your arguments with all those people paying twice PJ's salary to them.
 
clapper said:
That's a very skewed reality if Petrino, Rodriguez, and Saban are your 'Top Notch' coaches.

Saban was Chan-esque at Michigan State (6-5-1, 6-6, 7-5, 6-6, 10-2) and parlayed that into the LSU job (where he went 8-4, 10-3, 8-5, 13-1, 9-3), and finally 6-6 this year.

As for Miles, his recruits are just now true juniors. He has 16 seniors at his 26 starting (O, D, and skill ST) positions. He was 16-16 at OSU before then.

I'll take my chances with CPJ, thank you very much.
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Dead on about Saban and Petrino. And I agree with your larger point about judging how good a coach is by what he has had to work with. By that standard Paul Johnson is way up there in the stratosphere.

Saban has never won without elite talent. Even in Saban's 9-2 year at Michigan State, they got blown out BAD by Wisconsin and Purdue.

Then at LSU he had one season of fewer than three losses, with FSU/UF level talent and only playing one tough OOC game in the whole 5 years (@VT in 2002, losing badly). The SEC-West was not as tough then as it is now, and LSU had a disturbing tendency to get blown out badly under Saban as well. Their every year opponent is also Florida, who was down.

The other two guys have to be considered good though. By any measure Rodriguez has been outstanding at WVU, he's probably their best all time head coach with all respect to Nehlen's longevity.

Les Miles has done a fantastic job at both OSU and LSU. At OSU he had three consecutive winning seasons for the first time since Barry Sanders was there, and went 2-2 against Oklahoma. If he'd posted his first four records there at GT, with two wins over UGA, we'd have been distraught to see him leave.

Meanwhile at LSU he's posted three consecutive 11-2 seasons in a tougher SEC-West with Arkansas and Auburn peaking and with Urban Mayer fielding a national powerhouse at his cross-division rival. Much better than Saban did.
 
cyptomcat said:
On the other hand, if you don't think those coaches are top-notch though, you should go share your arguments with all those people paying twice PJ's salary to them.
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Bama is my second team by marriage so I've tried, but I've learned to stay quiet on the subject. I went to two Alabama games this year and have never seen anything like the worshipful adulation they showed for Nick Saban. Fortunately the sheen has worn off a bit, and next year they have to play all their tough games on the road so it's probably 2009 before they'll have a really good team. By which time maybe Saban will be treated more like a man than a demigod.

It would be awesome if WVU actually did hire him as then Bama could go after someone really awesome. My two favorite candidates for them last year were Jim Grobe and Paul Johnson.

Alabama has let the memory of Bear Bryant turn them into a very unhealthy coach-worship cult. Houndstooth is a fetish in Tuscaloosa.

Nevertheless, the sheer rabid lunacy of Alabama's attitude toward coaches does not make them any kind of legitimate authority. If anything it should effectively delegitimize anything they do. It's also not much of an argument against CPJ. :laugher:

Saban is a cult of personality that I have never understood, even back when he was at MSU in 1998-99 being talked about for bigger jobs and for NFL jobs.

To me, going on straight record and taking into account what each one had to work with, CPJ looks a lot better than Saban and Petrino and is at least as good as Miles and Rodriguez.
 
cyptomcat said:
On the other hand, if you don't think those coaches are top-notch though, you should go share your arguments with all those people paying twice PJ's salary to them.
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Your argument for their top billing as coaching candidates is based on the salaries they're paid by Alabama and Arkansas. Two of the craziest of the crazies in the SEC. Over the past two years they've tried to out do one another for the crown of insanity. They're living in their own realities over there.

As for the argument that Paul Johnson isn't top notch, because he didn't have big blue or any other big programs chasing after him, look at it like this. His biggest recruiting base will be Georgia. He has ties here and should be able to recruit well here. Think he could recruit as well up north or over in the land of loonies(Arkansas)?
 
ncjacket said:
So you're saying it's a risk because any hire is a risk? Or it's a risk because you don't think PJ is a good coach? Because the later is what jacketup is saying.
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The comments don't make sense until you correlate them with previous positions. Some fonts are setting themselves up to say "I told you so" while leaving an out in the likely event that they are wrong. They are rushing to pop the balloon before it is even inflated.

I've got news for those people, keeping Chan would have been "a risk". Hiring Tony Dungy would have been "a risk." Just because you didn't get your way is no reason to declare sour grapes now. You are no better than the "Can Chan" crowd who opposed him before he had a chance to coach a single game for GT.

All I know is that outside the SE, sports talk shows that I have heard are pretty unanimous in crediting GT with a great hire. This weekend our local sports radio was running down all the coaching changes. The "expert" being interviewed (sorry, I don't remember the name) reiterated the opinion that PJ would have a very different offense with the type of talent he could get at GT as opposed to Navy. We will still see the option, but PJ will adjust the offense to the talent available.

I was very encouraged to hear an unbiased outside opinion. (Well, he was pretty biased to PJ regardless of where he had gone.)
 
BuzzCzar said:
you apparently have your own dictionary, and also you have a BROKEN RECORD that you need to cut off

get over it, you are in the minority and you are wrong
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How do you know? He hasn't even coached a game here yet. The jury is still out.

Please don't worship this guy blindly like y'all did with Gailey.
 
srschirm said:
How do you know? He hasn't even coached a game here yet. The jury is still out.

Please don't worship this guy blindly like y'all did with Gailey.
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We're being optimistic. Which is a weird place to be as a Tech fan. I think I like it.
 
GoldenTornado said:
The other two guys have to be considered good though. By any measure Rodriguez has been outstanding at WVU, he's probably their best all time head coach with all respect to Nehlen's longevity.

Les Miles has done a fantastic job at both OSU and LSU.
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I agree that they are good. The suggestion was that they are 'top notch'. I don't see anything in their resumes that is better than CPJ's from a standpoint o recruiting, winning, building programs, etc. If anything CPJ has a better track record of stability and longevity than any of them.
 
GoldenTornado said:
Meanwhile at LSU he's posted three consecutive 11-2 seasons in a tougher SEC-West with Arkansas and Auburn peaking and with Urban Mayer fielding a national powerhouse at his cross-division rival. Much better than Saban did.
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As an Arkansas fan I must have missed when they were "peaking". As far as the "loonies" comment by somebody else, Arkansas has had for the last couple of years two of the best three running backs in the history of the school (and as good a combo as any in the history of the SEC which has a pretty good history) but the coach has qbs like Chan Gailey so they didn't accomplish much with them and that's why the expectations were higher than what we got.

It fascinates me to see fans at a place like Tech (my alma mater) look at Arkansas like its fans should be happy for what they are getting because it's the most they can expect while assuming that Tech ought to just go hire the right coach and just start winning 10 games a year even though they've averaged about 6.5 wins over the last 4 and a half decades. Then I read what the Arkansas people think about Tech and they don't understand why Tech fans shouldn't be happy with what they've had since they have no reason to expect more.

I have concluded that just about everybody thinks their school is somehow "special" and there are about 70 schools with fanbases who all think they can be perennial top 10 teams with just the right coach/system/whatever.
 
srschirm said:
How do you know? He hasn't even coached a game here yet. The jury is still out.

Please don't worship this guy blindly like y'all did with Gailey.
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Deal, provided y'all don't blindly hate him as much as Chan.

I won't be holding my breath though. ;)
 
srschirm said:
How do you know? He hasn't even coached a game here yet. The jury is still out.

Please don't worship this guy blindly like y'all did with Gailey.
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It isn't worship, it's called support. True, the jury is still out if he will win here...But it is also still out on whether or not he will lose. I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt starting out as most are on here.And you are preaching to the choir about Gailey on ST.
 
Explain to me how Houston Nutt wasted Darren McFadden, when he finished second in the Heisman race, two years in a row. Contrast that to Chan's handling of the Greatest Receiver in the History of Football. Nutt was ran out of town for off field shenanigans, and not even academic ones at that. If, as an Arkansas fan, you feel that Houston Nutt was not taking that school to level they should be, then I guess you'd be pleased with his "decision" to resign. Personally, I made my mind up about the Arkansas fan base after watching the Bobby Petrino press conference with the Hog call.

And yes, I believe a school that has four national titles, was coached by Heisman and Dodd, has the worst beat down in CFB history, and a rich tradition of football should be a national power every year. So we can agree there.
 
I think the Arkansas guy has some valuable insight to the mindsets of today's college fans. That said, the one biggest difference I see between Tech and Arkansas is we ran our coaching search in a responsible manner and got a guy who was a good fit.

Although heck, maybe Petrino's a good fit.
 
TampaJacket said:
Deal, provided y'all don't blindly hate him as much as Chan.
I won't be holding my breath though. ;)
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I don't think most hated chan....It was more like we gave up on him after the same ol' sh!t for six years. Time to move on!
 
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