CPJ Mad Bro

[aeromech]

Sorry to disagree, but none of them were starters! That’s the point. CPJ left us without a real QB for the P5 level. Tobias could run but couldn’t pass. Graham could sling it but his accuracy outside the chunk it play was terrible. He’ll be good a Southern because, like in high school his legs will produce plays - but at the P5 level it takes more than legs. Yates just got caught in between systems but he’s smart enough to use football to get him a free education at a top tier school. Ratliff, we’ll never know but that’s why you recruit year round. CPJ just didn’t do that and the excuses we have to come up with prove that. I’m telling you now one of the most important players on our team is Peery because QB is what runs college football. I like Yates, but there is a reason Collins is bringing this kid 3000 miles. When Sims takes the wrong hit we can’t make excuses anymore.

Sorry but you pick one and move out; which is what our OC eventually did; it just took him half a season to figure it out. You pick one of the guys you have and call plays knowing his strengths and weaknesses. Rotating 3-4 guys is not and was not the answer.

 

[ncjacket]

Sorry but you pick one and move out; which is what our OC eventually did; it just took him half a season to figure it out. You pick one of the guys you have and call plays knowing his strengths and weaknesses. Rotating 3-4 guys is not and was not the answer.

He did. The first one got hurt, the second one proved he couldn’t pass and by then the third guy figured out what he was supposed to be doing after missing spring getting eligible for school.

 

[goldmember]

Yes there are certainly some on here that try nothing but to tear down CPJ. Likewise there are also some that try nothing but to tear down CGC. My point is I think most people are somewhere in the middle. There is also no need to put "facts" in quotes. They are just that - facts. It is 100% factual that the roster CPJ inherited had more NFL talent on it than likely any we've had before. Even if there were some holes in it, having multiple NFL guys in there helps cover for them. IIRC, so far there is only one player in the NFL that CGC inherited. Possibility of a couple this year, one being a punter.

As for the argument about CPJ's offense being what made Dwyer look like the "next Bo Jackson," how come it didn't make anybody else look like that if Dwyers talent had nothing to do with it? And you also keep saying "playing a safety at qb." Nesbitt was not recruited to be a safety. He played qb in HS and was recruited at that position, so don't act like CPJ just took some random chicken-öööö and made chicken salad out of it. Nesbitt was our next QB regardless of if CPJ was the coach or not. Sure he went to NFL as a safety, but how many of CPJ's qb's are in the league as a QB?

We had 8 players on the 2008 that team drafted by the NFL. Those are facts. That is not a loaded roster. UGA has 26 players from the 2008 team drafted. That is a loaded roster. We had 7 drafted in 2014.
Posters in Stingtalk repeating the same thing over and over doesn’t make it a fact.

 

[goldmember]

Yeah what's so frustrating for me is that 99% of our fan base should've known there would be 2 horrible transition years at least. I thought our fan base was generally smart enough to see this coming. For CGC to take such heat when imo he's done an A+ job recruiting and rebranding is insane. Either there's a portion of our fan base with a low football iq or there's a portion of fans who just don't like how CGC is running things. Coming from CPJ to CGC is a hell of a culture change and a bunch of the white hairs can't handle it and just dream of the days of old and mock CGC at ant chance they get. The only way unfortunately to shut them up is to win and that was going to take some time.

I think most people understand this but I also think most people can’t watch their team lose without getting pissed off. Some blame CPJ and others Collins. Then they come on here and argue with each other.

 

[Diseqc]

 

[swampsting]

One needn't look further than the length of Collins' contract to see what the plan was. TStan didn’t go with 7 years because he is just a generous guy.

or maybe CGC's agent is a helluva negotiator.

 

[aeromech]

He did. The first one got hurt, the second one proved he couldn’t pass and by then the third guy figured out what he was supposed to be doing after missing spring getting eligible for school.

I guess everyone is imagining us playing multiple QB's in a single game, and beyond that a single drive. I seem to recall us pulling a QB in the middle of a series of downs and putting him back in a few plays later. The first game against Clemson we played Graham, Oliver, and Johnson. The second game against South Florida we played Johnson, Oliver, and Graham. The third game against the Citadel we played Johnson and Oliver. The fourth game against Temple we played Graham and Oliver. By the 5th game against UNC we finally seemed to settle on Graham.

 

[GoGATech]

I guess everyone is imagining us playing multiple QB's in a single game, and beyond that a single drive. I seem to recall us pulling a QB in the middle of a series of downs and putting him back in a few plays later. The first game against Clemson we played Graham, Oliver, and Johnson. The second game against South Florida we played Johnson, Oliver, and Graham. The third game against the Citadel we played Johnson and Oliver. The fourth game against Temple we played Graham and Oliver. By the 5th game against UNC we finally seemed to settle on Graham.

I guess everyone is also imagining that there weren't specific scenarios that led to that. Also, remember Tobias Oliver is the only one who had any real game experience to start the season. That is why he started against Clemson. Coaches wanted us to try and slow the game down with the qb that had experience. Lucas Johnson was the one all the media had been hyping from practice reports. Turns out he was one of those guys that excelled in practice but had "deer in headlights" syndrome on gamedays. Graham was in trouble academically and wasn't even sure if he'd be eligible for the fall. He had to buckle down and focus on school work, which caused him to fall behind in learning the offense.

So, Tobias started against Clemson which was the plan all along. Once that game got out of reach, and your struggling offensively, you start trying the other guys. Game 2 Johnson was the starter as everybody expected. He underwhelmed on gameday and we saw him get pulled for backups. Third game (Citadel) was going to be Graham's chance but he was injured in practice that week and did not play. Was in a walking boot on the sidelines not even dressed. Lucas Johnson started and got hurt that game is why Oliver came in. Temple game Graham just coming off injury so Tobias starts. He doesn't get much going offensively, so Graham is brought in and remained the starter from that point on. I don't know what could've been done much differently.

 

[GoGATech]

We had 8 players on the 2008 that team drafted by the NFL. Those are facts. That is not a loaded roster. UGA has 26 players from the 2008 team drafted. That is a loaded roster. We had 7 drafted in 2014.
Posters in Stingtalk repeating the same thing over and over doesn’t make it a fact.

For starters, nobody said it was a loaded roster overall. But compared to other GT rosters, yes it was. There were 8 upper classmen starters on the 2008 roster that were drafted. Not sure what you're smoking but we had 3 drafted in 2014 (2013 team). There were 5 total drafted off that 2014 team. CPJ was left 8 starters on one team that were NFL talent. There have been 11 of his recruits drafted from his 11 years coaching here. One of those was a transfer (AA), one was sort of gift wrapped and fell in his lap from the baseball team (Smelter), and one was a kicker (Butker).

 

[goldmember]

For starters, nobody said it was a loaded roster overall. But compared to other GT rosters, yes it was. There were 8 upper classmen starters on the 2008 roster that were drafted. Not sure what you're smoking but we had 3 drafted in 2014 (2013 team). There were 5 total drafted off that 2014 team. CPJ was left 8 starters on one team that were NFL talent. There have been 11 of his recruits drafted from his 11 years coaching here. One of those was a transfer (AA), one was sort of gift wrapped and fell in his lap from the baseball team (Smelter), and one was a kicker (Butker).

Well since the 2008 and 2009 GT team's didn't play prior or future GT teams but instead competed against UGA, Clemson, VT, etc.. then I think our talent relative to those teams is what's relevant here. NFL players from the 2014 team:

1. Deandre Smelter
2. Darren Waller
3. Shaq Mason
4. Harrison Butker
5. Adam Gotsis
6. DJ White
7. Chris Milton

 

[GoGATech]

Well since the 2008 and 2009 GT team's didn't play prior or future GT teams but instead completed against UGA, Clemson, VT, etc.. then I think our talent relative to those teams is what's relevant here. NFL players from the 2014 team:

1. Deandre Smelter
2. Darren Waller
3. Shaw Mason
4. Harrison Butker
5. Adam Gotsis
6. DJ White
7. Chris Milton

I meant position players when I said 5 drafted. Forgot about Milton because he didn't get drafted, so that makes 6. And the whole point of this discussion is the talent on the team compared to what it was at the beginning and end of CPJ's career here. That is why we are comparing to past and future teams. Look at it by decade: We can even start in the 70's:

1970-1979: 25 players drafted
1980-1989: 21 players drafted
1990-1999: 22 players drafted
2000-2009: 23 players drafted
2010-2019: 15 players drafted - 4 of those are from 2010 and don't belong to CPJ. One of the others is a kicker.

 

[johncu]

We had 8 players on the 2008 that team drafted by the NFL. Those are facts. That is not a loaded roster. UGA has 26 players from the 2008 team drafted. That is a loaded roster. We had 7 drafted in 2014.
Posters in Stingtalk repeating the same thing over and over doesn’t make it a fact.

This x 100.

We had some incredible players in that 2007 recruiting class, but Chan's teams consistently lacked depth. 2008 and 2009 were no different. Go back and look at our 2009 depth chart:

2009 Depth Chart

As good as guys like Dwyer, Thomas, Burnett, and Morgan were, we also had starters that were borderline D1 players. I'm not going to call out former GT SAs, but we had plenty of players that a) were not good 3O fits at all, and b) were not particularly good athletes.

For all of you "fact" people, we were projected to go 3-9 in 2008. That is a "fact". We all expected to suck ass, even though we already knew we had some fantastic young players. While it is certainly better than the average GT roster, it is absolutely revisionist history to go back and pretend that we had some stacked, can't-miss roster. It was an unbelievable coaching job by one of the best Xs and Os coaches in the country. Regression to the mean in recent years does not change that.

 

[goldmember]

This x 100.

We had some incredible players in that 2007 recruiting class, but Chan's teams consistently lacked depth. 2008 and 2009 were no different. Go back and look at our 2009 depth chart:

2009 Depth Chart

As good as guys like Dwyer, Thomas, Burnett, and Morgan were, we also had starters that were borderline D1 players. I'm not going to call out former GT SAs, but we had plenty of players that a) were not good 3O fits at all, and b) were not particularly good athletes.

For all of you "fact" people, we were projected to go 3-9 in 2008. That is a "fact". We all expected to suck ass, even though we already knew we had some fantastic young players. While it is certainly better than the average GT roster, it is absolutely revisionist history to go back and pretend that we had some stacked, can't-miss roster. It was an unbelievable coaching job by one of the best Xs and Os coaches in the country. Regression to the mean in recent years does not change that.

Here is the number of rostered NFL players on other teams we played in 2008:
UGA - 26
Miami - 25
LSU - 23
Clemson - 22
UNC - 17
FSU - 13
UVA - 12
VT - 12
GT - 8
Miss State - 6
Duke - 4
BC - 0

 

[Techbert]

...

For all of you "fact" people, we were projected to go 3-9 in 2008. That is a "fact". ...

So much wrong with your post. I will just mention one. That is not an objective fact. It was a subjective unsourced memory of a subjective opinion.

And while you may be able to source someone who projected us to go 3-9, yes it was a fact that it was his opinion but it was not an underlying fact that we were a 3-9 team.

It was actually a lack of confidence in the incoming coach Paul Johnson. Chan Gailey had a winning record every single year he was here, with a lot worse teams. That 2008 team had a sound foundation, so there was no reason to project them to 3-9 unless you thought the incoming coach was going to be suboptimal.

 

[goldmember]

That is not an objective fact. It was a subjective unsourced memory of a subjective opinion.

Like the 2008 team being loaded with talent.

 

[WracerX]

I meant position players when I said 5 drafted. Forgot about Milton because he didn't get drafted, so that makes 6. And the whole point of this discussion is the talent on the team compared to what it was at the beginning and end of CPJ's career here. That is why we are comparing to past and future teams. Look at it by decade: We can even start in the 70's:

1970-1979: 25 players drafted
1980-1989: 21 players drafted
1990-1999: 22 players drafted
2000-2009: 23 players drafted
2010-2019: 15 players drafted - 4 of those are from 2010 and don't belong to CPJ. One of the others is a kicker.

Our OL were good for the option, but not for other styles (Mason worked himself into being NFL capable, because his measurables really aren’t ideal). Abacks aren’t good for much in the NFL (not the small quick ones, unlike O Smith). That takes out about a third of your starters. Toss in an option QB not being desirable in the NFL and those draft numbers look just about right for the system.

 

[Techbert]

Like the 2008 team being loaded with talent.

Yes. It is my subjective opinion that these players had talent:

(I bolded a few. But go ahead and disrespect them if you want. I also noted a full senior class left behind. So claims for thin team are hard to back up. Some names cut due to post length.)


No. Player Pos Ht Wt Yr Hometown

1 Morgan Burnett S 6-1 198 So College Park, Georgia

2 Mario Butler CB 6-1 181 So Ponte Vedra Beach, Florida

3 Marcus Wright RB 5-8 175 Fr San Antonio, Texas

4 Brandon Leslie S 6-0 195 Fr Fresno, California

5 Greg Smith RB 6-3 195 Jr Atlanta, Georgia

6 Willie White DB 6-3 182 Fr Kingsland, Georgia

7 Tony Clark LB 6-1 213 Sr Garden City, Georgia

8 Demaryius Thomas WR 6-3 229 So Dublin, Georgia

9 Josh Nesbitt QB 6-1 214 So Greensboro, Georgia

10 Martin Frierson S 6-2 208 Jr Columbia, South Carolina

11 Jaybo Shaw QB 6-0 190 Fr Flowery Branch, Georgia

12 Anthony Barnes LB 6-3 231 So Cartersville, Georgia

12 Cody Hutchings K 5-10 175 Fr Monroe, Georgia

13 Tevin Washington QB 6-1 205 Fr Wetumpka, Alabama

13 Brandon Stanley CB 5-10 170 Sr Savannah, Georgia

14 Scott Blair K 6-0 173 So Calhoun, Georgia

15 Correy Earls WR 6-0 190 So Macon, Georgia

16 Bryce Dykes QB 6-1 181 Fr Atlanta, Georgia

17 Chris Tanner K 6-0 170 Fr Norcross, Georgia

17 Matt Braman LB 6-3 236 Sr Niwot, Colorado

18 Calvin Booker QB 6-4 234 Sr Atlanta, Georgia

20 Roddy Jones RB 5-9 194 Fr Stone Mountain, Georgia

21 Jonathan Dwyer RB 6-0 228 So Marietta, Georgia

22 Cooper Taylor S 6-4 195 Fr Atlanta, Georgia

23 Quentin Sims WR 6-3 190 Fr Cincinnati, Ohio

24 Embry Peeples RB 5-10 175 Fr Orlando, Florida

24 Scott Elder CB 5-9 160 So Stone Mountain, Georgia

25 DeRon Jasper S 6-2 198 So Dunwoody, Georgia

26 Dominique Reese CB 5-11 178 So Auburn, Alabama

27 Jonathan Malone WR 5-9 167 Jr Marietta, Georgia

28 Rashaad Reid CB 5-10 180 Fr St. Augustine, Florida

29 Jon Lockhart CB 6-0 190 Fr Blountstown, Florida

30 James Liipfert LB 6-0 234 Sr Marshallville, Georgia

31 Mohamed Yahiaoui K 5-11 215 Jr Roswell, Georgia

32 Jahi Word-Daniels CB 6-0 194 Sr Hoover, Alabama

34 Steven Sylvester LB 6-2 225 Fr McDonough, Georgia

35 Michael Peterson CB 5-11 185 Fr Tampa, Florida

36 Lucas Cox FB 6-0 254 So Lewisberry, Pennsylvania

37 Jerrard Tarrant S 6-0 189 Fr Carrollton, Georgia

37 Preston Lyons RB 6-0 220 So Atlanta, Georgia

38 Quincy Kelly RB 6-0 238 So Stone Mountain, Georgia

39 Tyler Barrett S 5-10 186 Sr Hagerstown, Maryland

40 Kamaron Riley CB 6-2 180 Fr Hawkinsville, Georgia

41 Anthony Egbuniwe DE 6-4 253 So Greenville, South Carolina

42 Malcolm Munroe LB 6-3 215 Fr Miami, Florida

43 Tyler Evans RB 5-8 190 Jr Acworth, Georgia

43 Anthony Allen RB 6-0 225 So Tampa, Florida

43 Alex Walker DB 6-0 180 Fr Augusta, Georgia

44 Albert Rocker LB 6-1 225 Fr New Market, Alabama

45 Andy Elakman K 6-0 160 Fr Calhoun, Georgia

45 Jason Davis RB 5-10 196 Jr Duluth, Georgia

46 Matt Kamp FB 5-11 240 Jr Alpharetta, Georgia

46 Mario Edwards DB 6-1 210 So Atlanta, Georgia

47 Jake Blackwood S 6-1 180 Jr West Palm Beach, Florida

48 Richard Watson FB 6-1 225 Fr Tallahassee, Florida

49 Lance Walls FB 6-1 238 Jr Dawsonville, Georgia

49 Austin Flanary LB 6-1 220 Fr Scottsdale, Arizona

50 Bret White LS 5-11 240 Sr Marietta, Georgia

51 Brad Jefferson LB 6-2 227 So Wrightsville, Georgia

52 Travis Chambers LB 5-11 232 Sr Decatur, Georgia

53 AJ Smith DL 6-7 299 Sr Tampa, Florida

54 Sedric Griffin LB 5-11 239 Jr Blair, South Carolina

55 David Brown OL 6-3 271 Sr Madison, Alabama

56 Osahon Tongo LB 6-3 252 So Naperville, Illinois

57 Shane Bowen LB 6-1 218 Jr Pickerington, Ohio

58 BJ Machen LB 6-1 225 Fr Hilliard, Ohio

59 Kyle Jackson LB 6-0 226 Fr McDonough, Georgia

60 Brad Sellers OL 6-2 252 Jr Grad Prairie, Texas

61 Phil Smith T 6-6 290 Fr Tampa, Florida

62 Omoregie Uzzi G 6-3 291 Fr Chamblee, Georgia

63 Chase Hudson OL 6-2 268 Fr Dacula, Georgia

63 Levi Walls LS 6-2 216 Jr Dawsonville, Georgia

64 Andrew Gardner T 6-6 305 Sr Tyrone, Georgia

65 Andrew Folkner OL 6-0 299 Sr Marietta, Georgia

66 Michael St. Denis OL 6-3 300 Fr Roswell, Georgia

67 Zach Fraysier OL 6-3 275 Fr Ball Ground, Georgia

67 Steven Powers DL 6-2 226 So Rome, Georgia

68 Drew Brannon OL 6-4 297 So Rockmart, Georgia

69 Alex Paquette OL 6-3 253 Jr Stockbridge, Georgia

70 Joseph Gilbert OL 6-4 288 Fr Cartersville, Georgia

71 Cord Howard T 6-5 310 Jr Phenix City, Alabama

72 Jason Hill T 6-4 299 Jr Atlanta, Georgia

73 Jeff Lentz OL 6-5 252 So Marietta, Georgia

73 Austin Barrick WR 6-3 254 So Moody, Alabama

74 Zach Krish OL 6-5 286 So Snellville, Georgia

75 Nick Claytor T 6-6 304 Fr Gainesville, Georgia

76 Nick McRae C 6-4 290 Fr Dublin, Georgia

77 Dan Voss OL 6-4 294 Jr Cherry Hill, New Jersey

78 Clyde Yandell OL 6-5 296 Fr St. Augustine, Florida

79 Sean Bedford DL 6-1 268 So Gainesville, Florida

79 Mike Johnson OL 6-4 300 Fr Lithonia, Georgia

80 Daniel McKayhan WR 6-0 180 Fr Decatur, Georgia

82 Kevin Crosby P 6-3 191 So Alpharetta, Georgia

83 Andrew Smith WR 5-11 191 Sr Tampa, Florida

84 Tyler Melton WR 6-0 199 Fr Houston, Texas

85 Chandler Anderson K 5-11 193 Fr Columbus, Ohio

86 Geoff Greco WR 6-3 210 Fr Wexford, Pennsylvania

86 Tyler Davis WR 6-0 199 Sr Duluth, Georgia

88 Kevin Cone WR 6-2 202 So Stone Mountain, Georgia

88 Antonio Wilson DE 6-6 220 Fr Decatur, Georgia

89 Paul Reese WR 6-0 178 Fr Albany, Georgia

90 TJ Barnes DT 6-7 325 Fr Enterprise, Alabama

91 Derrick Morgan DE 6-4 270 So Coatesville, Pennsylvania

92 Jason Peters DE 6-4 272 Fr Baton Rouge, Louisiana

93 Michael Johnson DE 6-7 260 Sr Selma, Alabama

94 Elris Anyaibe DT 6-3 280 Sr DeSoto, Texas

95 Darryl Richard DT 6-4 290 Sr Destrehan, Louisiana

96 Logan Walls DL 6-2 287 Fr Dawsonville, Georgia

97 Robert Hall DE 6-3 248 So Hawkinsville, Georgia

98 Ben Anderson DT 6-2 271 So Aiken, South Carolina

99 Vance Walker DT 6-2 293 Sr Fort Mill, South Carolina

 

[GoGATech]

Like the 2008 team being loaded with talent.

Once again, you're using the term loaded loosely. We're talking about what was left on the roster CPJ was given vs. what was left on the roster CGC was given.

 

[GoGATech]

Here is the number of rostered NFL players on other teams we played in 2008:
UGA - 26
Miami - 25
LSU - 23
Clemson - 22
UNC - 17
FSU - 13
UVA - 12
VT - 12
GT - 8
Miss State - 6
Duke - 4
BC - 0

What point are you trying to make? We all know how we have stacked up to our competition historically when it comes to recruiting and talent, but the fact is it was getting considerably worse. What would that list look like if you make that same comparison for 2015-2019? And then on top of that, you have people that will still argue that CGC should've been able to come in and go .500 with what he was left.

 

[knoxjacket]

In the 3 seasons preceding Johnson arriving at Tech we were ranked in 22 of 45 weeks.

In the 4 seasons preceding Collins we were ranked 3 of 60 weeks and zero times in the previous 45.

We were 30-21 in the four seasons before Johnson. 27-21 against the FBS. 20-12 against the ACC.

We were 24-25 the four seasons before Collins. 20-25 against FBS opponents. 14-18 against the ACC.

In 2007 we ran off a coach for not winning enough. In 2018 a coach retired because it wasn’t fun anymore (aka he was losing too much).