Explaining the Inexplicable

[BuzzinWreck78]

Joey Weaver latest article:

What’s less understandable is when a group like Georgia Tech’s secondary, which has seen incredible continuity throughout the Collins era and is arguably its single most talented position group on the roster, seemingly has gotten worse year-over-year. Even more baffling is that it’s happening under a head coach whose background is as a good defensive coordinator, and specifically one who had a strong track record of developing defensive backs prior to his arrival on the Flats.

There are four coaches that have some level of responsibility for the success of the secondary — Collins, DC Andrew Thacker, Co-DC/Safeties Coach Nate Burton, and Cornerbacks Coach Jeff Popovich. That brain trust has spent nearly 3 calendar years working with this unit, whose personnel is (again) arguably the most talented group on the roster, and whose continuity has been as good as anyone has asked for. The result? A group that’s getting shredded worse than they ever have before, looks confused on where to be, and seems to be having issues that are getting worse instead of better.

Explaining the Inexplicable

There’s a not-great phenomenon we’re seeing on the Yellow Jackets’ defense.

www.fromtherumbleseat.com

another quote, given the talent in our secondary I still don't understand how things got this bad -
" In 2021 contests against Pittsburgh, Duke, Virginia, and Virginia Tech, Georgia Tech’s defense has allowed a combined 67.2% completion for 1,341 passing yards, 12 touchdowns, only 1 interception, and all to the tune of 10.01 yards per pass attempt. (For context, only one FBS team is giving up more than 10.01 yards per attempt for the entire season, and it’s UMass.) "

 

[JJacket]

It is clear that something is not right. But only a few here are allowed to say what they believe is wrong without being personally blasted by our resident smart-ass and a few others. It's fine to disagree and to offer opinions, but let's stop the personal attacks.

That's Mr. Resident Smart Ass to you, punk

 

[PressManCoverage]

@JJacket and @PressManCoverage y'all are two of the most vocal supporters of CGC. Do y'all disagree with any part of the OP?

Can y'all see why that is part of the reason some of us are worried about Collins coaching ability?

JJ actually gave a good plan. Pressman, do you have anything other than blame CPJ or that the players suck to explain the OP?

I agree with the hard Stats, before the season started on other forums, I didn't want the Two 5th yr Safeties Back for 2021 because they played with no instincts in their 4th yr out of HS.

After the NIL Game, I wanted #3 out of the starting lineup.

I have no sympathy for guys that are 3 to 6 yrs out of HS that make Mental Mistakes and don't have a "feel" for the Game.

If a Guy runs past you or Runs over you and out-physicals you, I can forgive that as long as you played everything correctly, but I can't forgive when Guys make mental errors after almost 3 yrs of post HS development & Coaching.

I was one of the first that I remember asking for a Youth movement around here, especially on Defense.

 

[JJacket]

I agree with the hard Stats, before the season started on other forums, I didn't want the Two 5th yr Safeties Back for 2021 because they played with no instincts in their 4th yr out of HS.

After the NIL Game, I wanted #3 out of the starting lineup.

I have no sympathy for guys that are 3 to 6 yrs out of HS that make Mental Mistakes and don't have a "feel" for the Game.

If a Guy runs past you or Runs over you and out-physicals you, I can forgive that as long as you played everything correctly, but I can't forgive when Guys make mental errors after almost 3 yrs of post HS development & Coaching.

I was one of the first that I remember asking for a Youth movement around here, especially on Defense.

The TD Pitt scored against us was telling. Didn't cover the receiver in the same pattern the play before. Next play, Pitt puts a speedy WR in that position and we don't cover him for the Pitt TD.

 

[Tshirt Man]

I agree with the hard Stats, before the season started on other forums, I didn't want the Two 5th yr Safeties Back for 2021 because they played with no instincts in their 4th yr out of HS.

After the NIL Game, I wanted #3 out of the starting lineup.

I have no sympathy for guys that are 3 to 6 yrs out of HS that make Mental Mistakes and don't have a "feel" for the Game.

If a Guy runs past you or Runs over you and out-physicals you, I can forgive that as long as you played everything correctly, but I can't forgive when Guys make mental errors after almost 3 yrs of post HS development & Coaching.

I was one of the first that I remember asking for a Youth movement around here, especially on Defense.

So the players suck after "3 years of post HS development and coaching"?

If it was one or two players maybe. If it was one or two that sucked young and just never got better, maybe.

We are talking about a whole position group that showed a lot of athletic ability and skills when they first got here. There is no reason for them to look worse unless the "3 years of post HS development and coaching" screwed them up.

Maybe you need to stop ööööting on the players and former coach every chance you get and consider that your golden boy might not be a good coach.

I am not saying bring Johnson and the option back. I am not saying we have elite talent at every position. Collins will get time to turn things around but he doesn't get a free pass on every single issue just because he didn't have 30 five stars on the roster when he took over.

 

[PressManCoverage]

So the players suck after "3 years of post HS development and coaching"?

If it was one or two players maybe. If it was one or two that sucked young and just never got better, maybe.

We are talking about a whole position group that showed a lot of athletic ability and skills when they first got here. There is no reason for them to look worse unless the "3 years of post HS development and coaching" screwed them up.

Maybe you need to stop ööööting on the players and former coach every chance you get and consider that your golden boy might not be a good coach.

I am not saying bring Johnson and the option back. I am not saying we have elite talent at every position. Collins will get time to turn things around but he doesn't get a free pass on every single issue just because he didn't have 30 five stars on the roster when he took over.

Maybe in a clock burning Teflon Option Program, those defensive Players face 20 fewer snaps per Game?

Now that we are playing normal, modern CFB , those extra 20 looks that OCs get gives them more chances to scheme and expose their weaknesses & lack of discipline.

I have no idea why our Secondary plays so stupid when 12 Games of smarter Play would mean a 6 Figure signing bonus as 4th thru 7th Round Draft choice.

I wonder do our Upperclassmen in the secondary realize how much money they cost themselves, no matter what they do at the Combine NFL GMs will have no simpathy for the mistakes they made in 20 & 21, best they can hope for now is UDFA status.

 

[MACHETE]

Lots of dissension in that group and I will leave it at that. They don’t get along and their play on the field shows it

Tell us more Mookie.

 

[JJacket]

So the players suck after "3 years of post HS development and coaching"?

If it was one or two players maybe. If it was one or two that sucked young and just never got better, maybe.

We are talking about a whole position group that showed a lot of athletic ability and skills when they first got here. There is no reason for them to look worse unless the "3 years of post HS development and coaching" screwed them up.

Maybe you need to stop ööööting on the players and former coach every chance you get and consider that your golden boy might not be a good coach.

I am not saying bring Johnson and the option back. I am not saying we have elite talent at every position. Collins will get time to turn things around but he doesn't get a free pass on every single issue just because he didn't have 30 five stars on the roster when he took over.

Have any of us said we are happy with our DB's performance?

 

[AmpuTECHture]

Maybe in a clock burning Teflon Option Program, those defensive Players face 20 fewer snaps per Game?

Now that we are playing normal, modern CFB , those extra 20 looks that OCs get gives them more chances to scheme and expose their weaknesses & lack of discipline.

I have no idea why our Secondary plays so stupid when 12 Games of smarter Play would mean a 6 Figure signing bonus as 4th thru 7th Round Draft choice.

I wonder do our Upperclassmen in the secondary realize how much money they cost themselves, no matter what they do at the Combine NFL GMs will have no simpathy for the mistakes they made in 20 & 21, best they can hope for now is UDFA status.

They've been away from the option for 3 years now. The position group is worse today than it was in 2019. Option has nothing to do with it.

And the problem isn't the resume in regards to a QC position; it's all the small name schools next to those positions. We need more coaches with legit p5 experience

 

[Tshirt Man]

Have any of us said we are happy with our DB's performance?

Never said anybody said they were happy with it. Press blames everything on the players and former coach. My point is, one or two players may just get worse but when a whole position group looks worse after 3/4 years in the program than they did their first year, it leads me to believe there is a problem with coaching.

 

[JJacket]

Never said anybody said they were happy with it. Press blames everything on the players and former coach. My point is, one or two players may just get worse but when a whole position group looks worse after 3/4 years in the program than they did their first year, it leads me to believe there is a problem with coaching.

I think you are having difficulty following the conversation. There is plenty of blame to go around for staff and players. Our DB's seem to bite on play action and scrambles and leave their assignments. The way QB's have run against us doesn't surprise me they bite on this stuff. Plus, we look slow at a a few positions. Perhaps S&C needs to concentrate on speed and stamina of DB's and less on benching 225 lbs.
Fact is, none of us know. Combination of everything. Perhaps a few never were as good as we thought. Perhaps coaching has failed them. Perhaps S&C just has the wrong training program for the players. Maybe we need to change to a more aggressive defense and cut down on the length of time we have DB's in coverage each play. Don't know

 

[ee8384]

Prior to joining Collins at Temple, the person responsible for coaching the secondary had zero experience in coaching a position group at a major college. It is possible that is a part of the issues with the on-field performance. All good that he's a Tech man and such, but if you were building a staff for dealing with the biggest rebuild in history you might want to consider having position coaches that have dealt with the situation before.

That being said, having that experience is no guarantee of success. See OL.

 

[BainbridgeJacket]

Prior to joining Collins at Temple, the person responsible for coaching the secondary had zero experience in coaching a position group at a major college. It is possible that is a part of the issues with the on-field performance. All good that he's a Tech man and such, but if you were building a staff for dealing with the biggest rebuild in history you might want to consider having position coaches that have dealt with the situation before.

That being said, having that experience is no guarantee of success. See OL.

I think the OL example is prudent. Everyone has to start coaching somewhere and most position coaches get their start at small schools (if not, then that's even less experience than we're arguing about now? How much sense would that make?). I was hopeful that the glimpses of improvement we saw as the first season progressed would carry forward, but it's been excruciatingly slow development and as ST's enemy #1 points out, the players in the secondary have been especially prone to not doing their jobs and us getting punished when they play selfish ball and try to make a play rather than sticking to their assignment.

I postulate that we've got a bit of a Paul Hewitt problem on our hands. We're a 'developmental' program that seems more focused on the players as individuals than the team as a whole. I think we match up well physically against a lot of our schedule now, so I think we need to change our practice philosophy and ffs bench guys who intentionally abandon their assignments.

 

[PressManCoverage]

Never said anybody said they were happy with it. Press blames everything on the players and former coach. My point is, one or two players may just get worse but when a whole position group looks worse after 3/4 years in the program than they did their first year, it leads me to believe there is a problem with coaching.

Since you blame the "ambiguous catch-all of coaching", tell us exactly what the Coaches are doing wrong?

1. Is it the wrong practice drills?
2. Is it teaching bad reading of their "Keys" in film study?
3. Are the coaches ignoring the correct tackling drills and saying to themselves, "the hell with proper Technique, here's the wrong way to Tackle"?

Please give us more than just the ambiguity of "coaching"?

Example:
In the VaTech Game our CB had their QB 1on1 into the Boundary Side of the Field.

Every since the 8th Grade maybe younger every FB Player that Plays Defense KNOWS that there are 3 things you use to make a Tackle, your body (shoulder pads preferably), the Ground, AND THE SIDELINE, instead our DB (maybe #16), didn't get his head in front of the ball Carrier(QB), gave up the sideline, failed to push him OoB and gave up a 15yd scramble(maybe on 3rd down).

Fans like you that don't want to analyze, instead will say "it was coaching"!!

When the Facts are our Players have been drilled with those fundamentals since the 8th Grade, for a Sr or 5th year Player, that means 8 to 9 years of hearing the right way to do things.

Sometimes the Guy is off the charts Fast, but VaTech's QB wasn't - so this is a Player discipline issue or a lack of focus issue.

Examples like that are above are why I am hesitant to "blame Coaching" and instead I ask why why that Player choked or was slack in their fundamentals.

In FB all Coaches use the same strategies, same practice Techniques, same or similar Film Breakdown, probably the same or similar workouts & diet for their Team.

All this above and the many similar examples like this one that I haven't mentioned is why I always blame the Players first, but remember Coaches have to use Coach-speak in Pressers and can never publicly blame Players.

My guess is, 90% of the Time the Player is at fault.

I've explained myself, I challenge you to counter as to why you think it is "Coaching"?

 

[JJacket]

And don't get a 15 yard penalty when we stop VT on a 3rd and long giving them a first down. (May have been a facemask)

 

[PressManCoverage]

They've been away from the option for 3 years now. The position group is worse today than it was in 2019. Option has nothing to do with it.

And the problem isn't the resume in regards to a QC position; it's all the small name schools next to those positions. We need more coaches with legit p5 experience

My point that you missed(again) was that NOT running the Option, creates more Plays for both Teams and more opportunities to expose our undisciplined play in our Secondary.

Big difference between playing 60-65 snaps and playing 75-85 snaps.

 

[Tshirt Man]

Since you blame the "ambiguous catch-all of coaching", tell us exactly what the Coaches are doing wrong.

Losing?


I don't have all the answers. If I did I would be making millions as a coach.

I've never said the players are free from blame either. Yes they miss tackles and assignments. I'm not even saying you are completely wrong. Still confusing why they make more of the mistakes now versus when they were freshman though.

It just gets old seeing you öööö on the players and former coach in every post and refusing to admit that Collins and the other coaches share any of the blame. Even JJ will admit that the coaches are not perfect. That doesn't mean he wants the option back or that he hates Collins.

I think Collins can succeed here. I don't think he can with the staff he has now. Rebuild or not, all our problems can't be blamed on the players and former coach.

 

[Tshirt Man]

My point that you missed(again) was that NOT running the Option, creates more Plays for both Teams and more opportunities to expose our undisciplined play in our Secondary.

Big difference between playing 60-65 snaps and playing 75-85 snaps.

Not after the first two games. Of all your BS excuses, this may be my favorite.

 

[knoxjacket]

Meet the new defense same as the old defense.

 

[PressManCoverage]

Losing?


I don't have all the answers. If I did I would be making millions as a coach.

I've never said the players are free from blame either. Yes they miss tackles and assignments. I'm not even saying you are completely wrong. Still confusing why they make more of the mistakes now versus when they were freshman though.

It just gets old seeing you öööö on the players and former coach in every post and refusing to admit that Collins and the other coaches share any of the blame. Even JJ will admit that the coaches are not perfect. That doesn't mean he wants the option back or that he hates Collins.

I think Collins can succeed here. I don't think he can with the staff he has now. Rebuild or not, all our problems can't be blamed on the players and former coach.

I never hinted that the coaches were perfect.

IMO Upperclassmen Players lacking discipline is a bigger problem.

Remember when everyone said PNode was an idiot and that his Play-calling was flawed, now it looks like PNode might be a serviceable OC that just needs better OLine Play.

Maybe with more focus & discipline, our Defensive Coaches will also look to be serviceable Coaches