Information regarding the new "Tech Fund"

[clapper]

Exactly!!! And where exactly are you going to find a better value for the dollar on a season ticket package? Because pro teams and every other major college team are way more expensive than a GT tickets in the seating sections that we are talking about.

One suggestion I'd make for those that might find the mandatory license cost challenging, is to consider the long term option. Move to a section that doesn't require a license, but continue giving to A-T at the rate you are comfortable. You will earn points on a 2 for 1 basis, instead of 1 for 1 when paying for the license. Then when you can pay the fee more comfortably, you can request a seat upgraded and jump ahead of people that were paying the license fee all along.

As for the exodus everyone is expecting, I think it will mainly be in the lower, not upper price seats for football. Those in the upper levels might feel screwed because they have been paying for years to move up, but they not only have the money to pay it, they also have adult age children that can instantly 'inherit' those seats before next season.

And if you've seen the mailing that came out today on the program, you might have noticed that the transfer option is available for football only. That's because the dirty little secret is that the reseating that was supposed to take place before this season will happen sometime this summer. That's going to be interesting, and probably deserves a separate thread all its own.

 

[Cola_jacket]

We buy four tickets for the wife and two daughters. That cost over $1000 last year with the parking pass. I have been at the $250, now $300, giving level for years. Now, my seats in Section 226 require an additional $1000 -$300 = $700. We are lucky and can afford this, but we have decided not to pay it.

Now that I live in Columbia, SC, the football game has been an opportunity to see my brother and brother-in-law (and families) at the game. Also, I can visit my parents on Sunday. This trip usually runs us at least $150 for gas and food. We can sleep at someone's house. Also, the wife usually makes a trip to the bookstore during the season that runs another $100 - $200. So the economic impact is more than just the tickets.

I have several issues with the new "seat tax"

First, why did they wait till Feb. to let us know about this plan? The information says that it was approved by the Athletic Board in Oct.

Second, I have not watch a professional baseball game since the strike. From what I remember, all the seats behind home plate for the Braves games are owned by the law firms and corporations. Aren't these seats often empty? Don't you think some of this will go on with this plan?

Finally, our seats are right across the aisle from Section 227. There is a $100 difference in the tax. Maybe I could try to move there, but why make the effort? Don't you think the first few rows in 227 are better seats than the last few rows of 226? We actually sat in 227 until the last reseating. :laugher:

This would have been my 19th year buying tickets. Everyone has to determine when enough is enough. From reading the message boards, it sounds like most people are fine with this plan. For us, we have decided that we can use the money better elsewhere.

 

[beej67]

Balance the budget!


beej67,
one issue poster

 

[midatlantech]

NC and JTS, I just disagree. Certainly there are plenty of examples of people that give $1000 a year and now have to pay $250 per seat x 4 seats...

But I am talking about the loads of people who bought 4 or 8 seats instead of 2 and effectively were the sales department for the AA. Just about every Tech fan I know falls into this category. There is just no reason for them to do this any more, at this cost I mean.

And yes, at the last reseating I chose my seats on the aisle in a lower section than I needed to. I wanted the aisle and was happy enough. But my seatmates have already informed me that this plan is driving them away. And I know the non-Tech graduates that sit around me, some going back to Dodd, are just not going to fork up this money.

If you look at the numbers, we could easily have done this in a different way. One, we could have slowly integrated a plan instead of one day just cutting off the long term investment that we all gave to AT.

Secondly, we could have just raised the ticket prices for the big games every year, letting UGA fans in the north end zone pay for the price increase instead of us (again). As I have shown before, the net effect of this is the same as the net effect of squeezing more money from LESS season ticket holders.

Instead we are implementing a plan that is going to send Tech fans further into the hinterlands, while opening up good seats for the UGA faithful. The more this happens the less attractive it is to go to the games for a lot of Tech fans. We've already given away the club section to the opposition, why not the whole East?

My favorite, however, is what's going to happen when Sec 224 in the Upper East is empty up at the top. Who's getting those tickets for just face value?

 

[clapper]

But I am talking about the loads of people who bought 4 or 8 seats instead of 2 and effectively were the sales department for the AA. Just about every Tech fan I know falls into this category. There is just no reason for them to do this any more, at this cost I mean.

One, we could have slowly integrated a plan instead of one day just cutting off the long term investment that we all gave to AT.

Secondly, we could have just raised the ticket prices for the big games every year, letting UGA fans in the north end zone pay for the price increase instead of us (again). As I have shown before, the net effect of this is the same as the net effect of squeezing more money from LESS season ticket holders.

We've already given away the club section to the opposition, why not the whole East?

My favorite, however, is what's going to happen when Sec 224 in the Upper East is empty up at the top. Who's getting those tickets for just face value?

I think what they're trying to tell the folks that bought extra seats (and I am one) is that you can pretend you were doing them a favor, but you've been getting one hell of a free ride for quite some time and it's got to stop because it isn't paying the bills. All they're getting from you is cash for a seat they can likely sell anyway. They need us all to step up our commitment on a sustainable basis.

They could have phased it in had there not been such a budget crisis. They don't have that option now. And why is it that you seem to think that only other teams have fans with enough disposable income to mkae the jump into the middle of our best sections? This is a huge oppotunity for alot of people that couldn't make a huge single commitment in the past...especially if they get smart now and find some of the people who aren't willing to keep multiple seats, but don't want to fill the section with non-Techies.

Raising ticket prices is not feasible for two reasons. You have to remain priced for your market, and you can't count on actually having that marquee game when you have to schedule so far in advance. Again, that is NOT sustainable income.

The Club seats were not given away to the opposition. I know a number of Tech people that took advantage of moving down there from less desirable locations. It was more a matter of finding the correct price to move the seats. Those folks have already been paying the license fee and nobody over there is crying about it.

Short term, I think there will be 'holes' in various sections. Longer term, people will realize that they have some great options to fill those gaps and move themselves to better seats.

 

[knoxjacket]

In the interest of stirring the pot:

We wouldn't have this problem if we were in the SEC.

 

[ramblinwise1]

We buy four tickets for the wife and two daughters. That cost over $1000 last year with the parking pass. I have been at the $250, now $300, giving level for years. Now, my seats in Section 226 require an additional $1000 -$300 = $700. We are lucky and can afford this, but we have decided not to pay it.

Now that I live in Columbia, SC, the football game has been an opportunity to see my brother and brother-in-law (and families) at the game. Also, I can visit my parents on Sunday. This trip usually runs us at least $150 for gas and food. We can sleep at someone's house. Also, the wife usually makes a trip to the bookstore during the season that runs another $100 - $200. So the economic impact is more than just the tickets.

I have several issues with the new "seat tax"

First, why did they wait till Feb. to let us know about this plan? The information says that it was approved by the Athletic Board in Oct.

Second, I have not watch a professional baseball game since the strike. From what I remember, all the seats behind home plate for the Braves games are owned by the law firms and corporations. Aren't these seats often empty? Don't you think some of this will go on with this plan?

Finally, our seats are right across the aisle from Section 227. There is a $100 difference in the tax. Maybe I could try to move there, but why make the effort? Don't you think the first few rows in 227 are better seats than the last few rows of 226? We actually sat in 227 until the last reseating. :laugher:

This would have been my 19th year buying tickets. Everyone has to determine when enough is enough. From reading the message boards, it sounds like most people are fine with this plan. For us, we have decided that we can use the money better elsewhere.

I feel your pain. I gave $1000 to AT and another $1000 to GT Foundation on 12/31. (I'm not saying this to impress anybody, just point out the order of magnitude of the issue). Now this with no credit or benefit associated with that recent sacrifice. Had I known about this I certainly would NOT have chunked big change down for AT fund. "Fool me once, shame on you..." It sounds like I won't even get the opportunity to reseat in a better location, but I still haven't received anything in writing to go on so its all hearsay at this point.

It seems clear that they delayed the timing of announcing this to screw people like me. They knew we would have factored down our AT gift to cover some of the cost of the seat tax.

So, sad to say, I will just let them go this year and see what I can scrape up for the games I want to go to. In 2007 I won't give squat to AT fund and I will consider buying season tickets again next year. I feel used and abused by this process.

They should at least given people some credit this first year for their other giving.

 

[ramblinwise1]

In the interest of stirring the pot:

We wouldn't have this problem if we were in the SEC.

What the H does this mean? Don't all the SEC schools do this kind of BS?

 

[clapper]

Had I known about this I certainly would NOT have chunked big change down for AT fund. "Fool me once, shame on you..." It sounds like I won't even get the opportunity to reseat in a better location, but I still haven't received anything in writing to go on so its all hearsay at this point.

It seems clear that they delayed the timing of announcing this to screw people like me. They knew we would have factored down our AT gift to cover some of the cost of the seat tax.

They should at least given people some credit this first year for their other giving.

Fool you? They hire an AD that has already been instrumental in implementing this same program at two other schools. They announce budget shortfalls starting last summer. They postpone reseating for basketball. The Board approves the program in October. And you are somehow surprised by a February announcement? It sounds more like you screwed yourself by not paying attention.

As far as reseating, if you pay attention now, you have an opportunity to get better seats than you ever would have under any reseating plan.

 

[ramblinwise1]

Fool you? They hire an AD that has already been instrumental in implementing this same program at two other schools. They announce budget shortfalls starting last summer. They postpone reseating for basketball. The Board approves the program in October. And you are somehow surprised by a February announcement? It sounds more like you screwed yourself by not paying attention.

As far as reseating, if you pay attention now, you have an opportunity to get better seats than you ever would have under any reseating plan.

Oh so its my responsibility to find out about stuff that is not released publicly, not published on the AA website, not put out in press releases...

I guess I should just drop in to the AA a few times a week and see whats being discussed around the water cooler!!

 

[WracerX]

Sweet, looks like I'll have better seats next year. Hope all of the old money is ready to stand the entire game!

 

[clapper]

Oh so its my responsibility to find out about stuff that is not released publicly, not published on the AA website, not put out in press releases...

I guess I should just drop in to the AA a few times a week and see whats being discussed around the water cooler!!

Did you look into the AD's background when he was hired? It said he was instrumental in instituting this same program at both USC-E and LSU.

Do you read 'The Good Word' that this AD has been e-mailing to season ticketholders and also post on ramblinwreck.com? If you did, you'd know that he first started posting the state of our finances and comparisons to other programs in Issue #4 on June 23 of last year.

You might also want to read paragraph four of Issue #16, dated November 9, where he says...

"In the coming weeks I will be sharing with you our road map to the future. We are in the final stages of developing a four-pronged plan that will create the financial foundation for Georgia Tech Athletics. Our own efficiency and fiscal responsibility within the athletic department has been a priority since my arrival. In addition, our plan will call for a shared investment in our product with increased financial involvement from the Institute itself, from Georgia Tech students and finally from our season ticket-holders in preferred seating locations. While I realize that change is never easy, I urge you to understand the complexity of what is at stake as we share this path with you very soon."

Tell me again why you didn't know this was coming.

:wow: :wow: :wow: :wow:

 

[beej67]

Methinks clapper is going to step up and win another thread.



I wonder if the freakoutery level would be nearly as high if they called it a "Offensive Coordinator Collection Plate Fee" and claimed they were going to earmark it towards Coker's salary.

 

[midatlantech]

I think what they're trying to tell the folks that bought extra seats (and I am one) is that you can pretend you were doing them a favor, but you've been getting one hell of a free ride for quite some time and it's got to stop because it isn't paying the bills. All they're getting from you is cash for a seat they can likely sell anyway. They need us all to step up our commitment on a sustainable basis.

They could have phased it in had there not been such a budget crisis. They don't have that option now. And why is it that you seem to think that only other teams have fans with enough disposable income to mkae the jump into the middle of our best sections? This is a huge oppotunity for alot of people that couldn't make a huge single commitment in the past...especially if they get smart now and find some of the people who aren't willing to keep multiple seats, but don't want to fill the section with non-Techies.

Raising ticket prices is not feasible for two reasons. You have to remain priced for your market, and you can't count on actually having that marquee game when you have to schedule so far in advance. Again, that is NOT sustainable income.

The Club seats were not given away to the opposition. I know a number of Tech people that took advantage of moving down there from less desirable locations. It was more a matter of finding the correct price to move the seats. Those folks have already been paying the license fee and nobody over there is crying about it.

Short term, I think there will be 'holes' in various sections. Longer term, people will realize that they have some great options to fill those gaps and move themselves to better seats.

Clapper, the point I was making is that by taking away the "perk" of getting any number of seats for one donation, takes away a major way that Tech fans get other potential fans to the game. I guess if the AA thinks there are people out there that are ripping off the system with one donation then this will hurt/help income depending on your point of view. Most people I know extend themselves enough for their ticket and an extra or two for friends, etc. I just don't see people doing this anymore. And I just don't see the Tech nation as being deep enough to pick up the slack.

Regarding outside infiltrators, the old AT system rewarded long term support. Additionally the reseating was only every five years or so and in the end, infiltrators were few.

Tomorrow, 1000 UGA fans could purchase decent seats on the cheap, compared to our long term investment (20 years for me). Enjoy sitting next to the scum, that will ruin the game for a lot of people.

 

[clapper]

Clapper, the point I was making is that by taking away the "perk" of getting any number of seats for one donation, takes away a major way that Tech fans get other potential fans to the game.

Most people I know extend themselves enough for their ticket and an extra or two for friends, etc. I just don't see people doing this anymore. And I just don't see the Tech nation as being deep enough to pick up the slack.

Tomorrow, 1000 UGA fans could purchase decent seats on the cheap, compared to our long term investment (20 years for me). Enjoy sitting next to the scum, that will ruin the game for a lot of people.

Don't think I don't understand your point. This deal absolutely sucks for me, particularly with basketball.

The AD's position is that he needs us to be salesmen for the team. If you're going to give up seats, transfer them to someone willing to move up or down, or better yet, find someone new like the 'friends' that have been scamming you for tickets. :D

He said that Season Ticket accounts at LSU went from 14K to 18K when they allowed transfers. Granted, we aren't them, but I think his point is welltaken. There are a number of folks that have been skating by for a while and need to step up. Hell, I'm one of them, sort of.

You can get pissed about a precious little perk being taken away, but the fact is that the model sucked. Instead of worrying about ourselves, shouldn't we be thinking about the program and its betterment? Maybe it does screw up some folks short term, but others of us will benefit, and every one of us will find ways to adapt to the new situation. Running away from it all doesn't help anybody.

Frankly, it concerns me very much that anyone that considers themselves a holder of 'prime seats' is unable to budget for this increase. Absolute worst case for four of the best basketball AND football tickets is less than $4K per year. Most everyone around here is complaining or bumps that are more like $1K or less.

It may sound harsh, but if that kind of money is causing problems for folks with degrees from GT, they probably have bigger issues and should be re-evaluating more than just their season tickets. And before any of y'all start crapping on me for being an asshole, I've already been there. I gave up great seats years back for both football and basketball for just that reason. Try sitting by yourself in the old south endzone horseshoe with your family on $1 tickets when you used to be between the thirties. Or giving up prime corner seats for no tickets at all (IN 1990!!!) without knowing if you'll ever see the inside of the coliseum again.

It tore me up to do it. You suck it up and work your way back.

 

[77GTFan]

I always thought we looked pretty foolish with lower deck, premium sideline seats between the thirties sparsely filled in the east stands due to club seating. Perhaps we just want a matching west stands!

I do wonder if people opt out of lower west premium seats and move to the twenties, thereby driving out some of those season ticket holders to the upper deck or further in the corners, if we will lose some of those season ticket holders.

But, the bottom line is the $$$. Surely DRad has calculated risk and return and believes this plan will bring in more money than the status quo. This is the price we pay for the rapid escalation of coaching pay. The goal is not to please alumni and loyal fans. The goal is to increase revenue. A corporation or well-heeled Dawg or Tiger fan with the cash is far more important to the GTAA than the Tech loyalist who cannot pay thousands to attend the games. That is my dose of cynical realism for today.

 

[midatlantech]

. And before any of y'all start crapping on me for being an asshole.

Enough said.

 

[midatlantech]

I always thought we looked pretty foolish with lower deck, premium sideline seats between the thirties sparsely filled in the east stands due to club seating. Perhaps we just want a matching west stands!

I do wonder if people opt out of lower west premium seats and move to the twenties, thereby driving out some of those season ticket holders to the upper deck or further in the corners, if we will lose some of those season ticket holders.

But, the bottom line is the $$$. Surely DRad has calculated risk and return and believes this plan will bring in more money than the status quo. This is the price we pay for the rapid escalation of coaching pay. The goal is not to please alumni and loyal fans. The goal is to increase revenue. A corporation or well-heeled Dawg or Tiger fan with the cash is far more important to the GTAA than the Tech loyalist who cannot pay thousands to attend the games. That is my dose of cynical realism for today.

I have met very few people in the world in finance and risk that can outperform a Tech graduate on issues such as these. But what do i know.

It sure seems to me that we're squeezing a square box into a southeastern circular hole. The cost to attend an NFL game at the 20 yard line is $100 per ticket. In my case, I bought a PSL for $1500/ticket that is now worth $8,000. Meanwhile every game is a good game that I can easily sell for $200 on average.

At Tech, at the 20 yard line it will now cost $150 per ticket and half the games suck. I can sell tickets on the street for most games for $25. Free market suggests to me that this plan is not written the best way.

 

[ramblinwise1]

Did you look into the AD's background when he was hired? It said he was instrumental in instituting this same program at both USC-E and LSU.

Do you read 'The Good Word' that this AD has been e-mailing to season ticketholders and also post on ramblinwreck.com? If you did, you'd know that he first started posting the state of our finances and comparisons to other programs in Issue #4 on June 23 of last year.

You might also want to read paragraph four of Issue #16, dated November 9, where he says...

"In the coming weeks I will be sharing with you our road map to the future. We are in the final stages of developing a four-pronged plan that will create the financial foundation for Georgia Tech Athletics. Our own efficiency and fiscal responsibility within the athletic department has been a priority since my arrival. In addition, our plan will call for a shared investment in our product with increased financial involvement from the Institute itself, from Georgia Tech students and finally from our season ticket-holders in preferred seating locations. While I realize that change is never easy, I urge you to understand the complexity of what is at stake as we share this path with you very soon."

Tell me again why you didn't know this was coming.

:wow: :wow: :wow: :wow:

Clapper, I'm beginning to think your an AA employee planted here to give us the party line and attack anyone who questions it.

Where in all the information you quoted did it say that we were going to introduce a new seat tax that wouldn't be detailed until after all you fellows made your year-end tax contributions that won't give you any credit for what you gave in '06? I would have been more than happy to support a plan that was well thought out and didn't try to shaft the loyal long-term season ticket holders.

The devil is in the details my friend.

True story: Our small town country club decided they weren't going to be able to cover operating expenses so they did some "SEC type" thinking and sent out a notice that said they were going to increase monthly dues and all fees, and that with the increases they would raise an additional $22K/year!! Low and behold, so many members quit that they actually lost $35K/year in monthly dues!! Its called economics, supply and demand.

Keep berating me, clapper, I would love to see this thread at the top of the board for 5 to 6 months. Hell, we may even make the AJC.

The irony is that I will be at every game I want to next year sitting in free seats offered to my by our suppliers....

 

[floridajacket]

I have met very few people in the world in finance and risk that can outperform a Tech graduate on issues such as these. But what do i know.

It sure seems to me that we're squeezing a square box into a southeastern circular hole. The cost to attend an NFL game at the 20 yard line is $100 per ticket. In my case, I bought a PSL for $1500/ticket that is now worth $8,000. Meanwhile every game is a good game that I can easily sell for $200 on average.

At Tech, at the 20 yard line it will now cost $150 per ticket and half the games suck. I can sell tickets on the street for most games for $25. Free market suggests to me that this plan is not written the best way.

What disturbs me about your argument is how much you try to crap on Tech's football program to make your point.

In the last two years, there have been more Tech fans attending more big games than ever before. Clemson and UGA in 2005 and ND and Miami in 2006 were pretty well filled with Tech fans. Do you really think Miami fans travel well enough to sell out our stadium?

As for club seating, more people buy those seats than sit in them for lesser games. Especially on hot September afternoons, many go inside the lounge area to watch the game. And for the bigger games, Tech fans sit down and fill those seats at this point. I don't remember a bunch of ND and Miami fans in those seats last year.

Next year, IIRC, we play ugag, Clemson, VPI, BC and UNC at home. Those are two guaranteed sellouts, one that should be a sellout (I hate how VPI is a Thursday night game) and two should have pretty healthy attendence. Even Army might do pretty well when it's picked as the homecoming game. Yeah, Samford will suck, but that's one out of seven games we play at BDS, and we had 40+ thousand attend last year's game against them.

Becoming a great or mediocre team is in some ways a self-fulfilling prophesy. If the fanbase themselves considers Tech permenantly a mediocre team, then the team will stay mediocre. If we consider ourselves capable of being a great team and support Tech accordingly, then we'll eventually become a great team.