jekyll and hyde

EagleSting said:
My thoughts are, GC was so awful that whoever was made interim coach would've had some kind of success. We've been buried in crap coaching for long enough to think that any kind of success is an indication of future results. That's the danger of Key, imo. We just ate a huge-to-us buyout. We are not in a position to entrust an 4-3 (corrected) interim coach who is trying to piece together how to be a HC as he goes.
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I would argue it's precisely because of the monstrous buyout that we need to consider Key. We can give him a short contract with more incentives than guaranteed money and make 2023 the interview year, while spending on a proven coordinator to replace Long.
 
andrew said:
Doesn't our financial position make it more likely that Key gets the job? Because we'll almost certainly be able to get him for less than our other options, and, more importantly, he wouldn't have the leverage to force a huge buyout into the contract.
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From a pure contract perspective, I would agree with you. Personally, I'd be examining a candidate's body of work against Key's and making a determination of what kind of added value he brings to the table, who brings more intrinsic value (recruits, etc), extrinsic in terms of bowls, wins, etc. Key represents risk because you're really betting on him being a diamond in the rough versus candidates who are already more polished than Key. Key would have to do something remarkable. For me, that's making a statement against UGA and winning the bowl. 4-3 is awesome, 6-3 is a game changer. At that point, I'd be willing to go with Key over Chadwell.
 
EagleSting said:
From a pure contract perspective, I would agree with you. Personally, I'd be examining a candidate's body of work against Key's and making a determination of what kind of added value he brings to the table, who brings more intrinsic value (recruits, etc), extrinsic in terms of bowls, wins, etc. Key represents risk because you're really betting on him being a diamond in the rough versus candidates who are already more polished than Key. Key would have to do something remarkable. For me, that's making a statement against UGA and winning the bowl. 4-3 is awesome, 6-3 is a game changer. At that point, I'd be willing to go with Key over Chadwell.
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Mostly agreed, although I do think Chadwell still carries a lot of risk himself since he hasn't done it at the P5 level before.
 
andrew said:
Mostly agreed, although I do think Chadwell still carries a lot of risk himself since he hasn't done it at the P5 level before.
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No doubt, I'm sure we all had the same thoughts with PJ at first. It's hard to evaluate if Chadwell has struck upon a concept that makes him one of those rare coaches that just wins at any level
 
WracerX said:
That’s my point. He fixed the easy stuff, but is still left with a below average punt unit. That can be fixed, but it will take the off season.

Nobody could have turned that unit into a good unit overnight. And nobody can make it a weapon (see Uva and Miami units success) without an off season.
So the ‘turnaround’ is from horrific to below average. That isn’t necessarily going to be the case next season.

We have managed to win 4 close games with the unit we have. Bring them to average and Duke and VT aren’t close and maybe Uva flips.
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But that’s what I’m saying, is that Key is only doing an average job. Anyone could’ve easily made this team a bowl eligible team. Collins was just that bad, that we’re seeing mediocrity as some accomplishment.
 
CarsonNewmanJacket said:
But that’s what I’m saying, is that Key is only doing an average job. Anyone could’ve easily made this team a bowl eligible team. Collins was just that bad, that we’re seeing mediocrity as some accomplishment.
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Key went 4-3 in the ACC with the wretched base that GC left him. Two of the 3 loses were games where the backup qb played significant minutes due to injury. Is that enough to win him the job? No, but it is enough to hear his plan for the future.

I think Key has shown himself to be an above average HC. He offers stability. But I think we would have to seriously upgrade the staff around him to break away from a 7 win average.
 
WracerX said:
Key went 4-3 in the ACC with the wretched base that GC left him. Two of the 3 loses were games where the backup qb played significant minutes due to injury. Is that enough to win him the job? No, but it is enough to hear his plan for the future.

I think Key has shown himself to be an above average HC. He offers stability. But I think we would have to seriously upgrade the staff around him to break away from a 7 win average.
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Again, CGC didn’t leave him with a “wretched base.” He had a ton of talent. Collins just sucked so bad at coaching, he made them look like trash. Same reason that everyone who transferred out is having a ton of success, even at schools like UVA.
 
Hell, give Key a chance. He is a Tech Man after all, coached under Saban and the players respect him. Kirby’s first year at Ugag, with way better players //On December 6, 2015, Smart was announced as the 26th head football coach at the University of Georgia. Smart went 8–5 in his first season as the head coach of the Bulldogs in 2016. ( with a homecoming loss to Vandy of all things!)
So I believe he could be the answer or at least a major step forward for a program that has more history than Ugag ever thought of having. Just my 2¢ though. GO JACKETS!!!
 
CarsonNewmanJacket said:
Again, CGC didn’t leave him with a “wretched base.” He had a ton of talent. Collins just sucked so bad at coaching, he made them look like trash. Same reason that everyone who transferred out is having a ton of success, even at schools like UVA.
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Coaching is cumulative. There isn’t a switch for ‘good’ coach and ‘bad’ coach. It takes time to work on fundamentals. And time is at a premium during the season. You are trying to game plan for the next opponent. You don’t have time to reps footwork or technique or what have you. Key is building off of GC fundamentals.
 
WracerX said:
Coaching is cumulative. There isn’t a switch for ‘good’ coach and ‘bad’ coach. It takes time to work on fundamentals. And time is at a premium during the season. You are trying to game plan for the next opponent. You don’t have time to reps footwork or technique or what have you. Key is building off of GC fundamentals.
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But there is though… when a guy is so bad, like CGC, and you bring in a guy that is decent, he will look like he’s improved a ton, when all he did was undo idiot coaching.
 
GTCrew said:
On one hand, turning it around as fast as he did is quite amazing.

On the other hand, I dont think any of the opposing coaching staffs thought they needed to prepare for us, thinking they could just line up mano-a-mano and their mano was better than ours. Brown admitted as much in the press conference.
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They have short memories.SAME thing happened to them last yr and I luv it, Die UNCheat.
 
CarsonNewmanJacket said:
But there is though… when a guy is so bad, like CGC, and you bring in a guy that is decent, he will look like he’s improved a ton, when all he did was undo idiot coaching.
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True. But the acc record is an objective measure. We will finish no worse than 3rd in the coastal. We will have beaten the 3best teams in our division. Our record in the coastal will be 5-1, same as unc. That is the sign of a good coach.

Is that enough to win the job? Not on its own, but it is good enough to at least hear the guy out on his vision for the team.
 
The kids and coaches have been on a roller coaster ride they didn’t ask to be on. I think they’ve all done remarkably well under the circumstances.
 
BigDanT said:
This is exactly why I’m not sold under Key. This team could be 6-6 to 7-5 under him without the WTF losses
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And we could do the same under any or all of those currently being considered. As the old saying goes, "you pays your money, and you takes your chances." NOBODY is guaranteed success at Tech.
 
THWUGA said:
This is the biggest problem hiring first time head coaches. A lot of teams are inconsistent. Same in business. Add that he was thrown to the fire mid season with 5 days of prep…..

Man I’m torn. He was in my top 3, but 3rd…. Tough one. I don’t envy Batt.
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Remember, O'Leary was 0-3 as an interim with some pretty good talent, and he had no prior HC experience. Other than some problems he created for himself, I'd say he did pretty damn good as a HC. No reason not to think Key COULD do the same, since he's already got 4 wins as an interim, and, from what I can see, he has the team solidly behind him.
 
WracerX said:
True. But the acc record is an objective measure. We will finish no worse than 3rd in the coastal. We will have beaten the 3best teams in our division. Our record in the coastal will be 5-1, same as unc. That is the sign of a good coach.

Is that enough to win the job? Not on its own, but it is good enough to at least hear the guy out on his vision for the team.
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No, I said the entire time if Key wants this job he had to get us to 6 wins. He’s just in a good situation where we’re in the worst power 5 division in the NCAA. We should have won, and not lost to UVA or Miami.
 
CarsonNewmanJacket said:
No, I said the entire time if Key wants this job he had to get us to 6 wins. He’s just in a good situation where we’re in the worst power 5 division in the NCAA. We should have won, and not lost to UVA or Miami.
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So 6-7 with a bowl win?
 
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