Shotgun?

1) When CPJ passed more at Hawaii it was not out of a shotgun.

Passing offense <> shotgun

2) Improving the passing game <> shotgun

We need to learn to pass effectively from the standard set, without tipping the offense to whether we will run or pass. There is no reason this can't be done with a decent OL or if the running game is working.

3) Shotgun makes sense when the defense knows we are going to pass anyway. However, I question how effective it will be if we don't practice it much. Perhaps we will run the same pass plays so the only difference will be the drop-back delay. So, as long as the QB and C have it together it shouldn't be a big deal to shift to it.

4) There is no evidence we have tried or ever will try pistol or skee-gun. What was seen in practice was vanilla shotgun.
 
lonestarjacket said:
1) When CPJ passed more at Hawaii it was not out of a shotgun.

Passing offense <> shotgun

2) Improving the passing game <> shotgun

We need to learn to pass effectively from the standard set, without tipping the offense to whether we will run or pass. There is no reason this can't be done with a decent OL or if the running game is working.

3) Shotgun makes sense when the defense knows we are going to pass anyway. However, I question how effective it will be if we don't practice it much. Perhaps we will run the same pass plays so the only difference will be the drop-back delay. So, as long as the QB and C have it together it shouldn't be a big deal to shift to it.

4) There is no evidence we have tried or ever will try pistol or skee-gun. What was seen in practice was vanilla shotgun.
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I tend to agree with most of this. We need to pass out of the same set we run out of as a tactical adjustment. Against Iowa we needed to pass to the wideouts when the corners crashed. So the play needs to look like the option, then pass over the corner crashing the pitch man. Otherwise we are going to see a lot of the corners crashing the pitchman this year because it was a truly effective defensive maneuver against us.
 
ramblinwise1 said:
I tend to agree with most of this. We need to pass out of the same set we run out of as a tactical adjustment. Against Iowa we needed to pass to the wideouts when the corners crashed. So the play needs to look like the option, then pass over the corner crashing the pitch man. Otherwise we are going to see a lot of the corners crashing the pitchman this year because it was a truly effective defensive maneuver against us.
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This was the quad option that Clemson ran so effectively in the '70s. Steve Fuller was the CU qb and Jerry Butler(no not that one) was the wr.
 
ramblinwise1 said:
I tend to agree with most of this. We need to pass out of the same set we run out of as a tactical adjustment. Against Iowa we needed to pass to the wideouts when the corners crashed. So the play needs to look like the option, then pass over the corner crashing the pitch man. Otherwise we are going to see a lot of the corners crashing the pitchman this year because it was a truly effective defensive maneuver against us.
Click to expand...

Corners crashing is not a good defensive maneuver against the triple option. When we get a Cloud scheme (Corner is force defender), we just switch block and send the slot back to the corner. If they fire the corner, it makes for a relatively easy kick block or cut block. If the block is made, it will be a touchdown more often than not.
 
ramblinwise1 said:
I will repeat for the 20th time. If we DO NOT learn to use the pass more effectively then our offense will do no better, in fact I suspect it will do worse as people learn better ways of defending it.

DO YOU HEAR ME PJ?

That means you need to work the passing offense every game, ESPECIALLY when you have the comfortable lead.
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Listen Mr. Wise... I would like to hear you say that to PJ's face. I really would. So he could tell you that when you win 4 national titles with your offense and our first 10 win season and ACC title in 20 years, then you can tell him what he has to do. DO YOU HEAR ME??

Ass.

Besides that though, I agree that pass protection is something that the Olinemen will be working on.
 
bigsexy1211 said:
Listen Mr. Wise... I would like to hear you say that to PJ's face. I really would. So he could tell you that when you win 4 national titles with your offense and our first 10 win season and ACC title in 20 years, then you can tell him what he has to do. DO YOU HEAR ME??

Ass.

Besides that though, I agree that pass protection is something that the Olinemen will be working on.
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We won 10 and an ACC title in 1998.
 
GTLiebs said:
Then odds are this plan won't be much worse. At the very least it'll be a formation more friendly to passing and pass protection than our standard formation.
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In this scenario will the linemen pass block or will they still charge run block?
 
I think anyone that expects Tech to try to be something that they are not is very foolish. I agree that a little more passing would help off set the line backers from creeping up to the line of scrimmage to take away the run. But we will never be a 50% run / 50% pass team. That is not our style. But I really believe that a more balanced passing / run game for Tech is 70 % / 30%. The thing is the 30% has to be completed at a higher % than last year. Don't just throw when you have to and don't go for it all when you do pass. Some short crossing routes completed at a high percentage would be fine. Just accept Tech for what we are and that is a great running / ball control team that is Coached by in my opinion a brilliant football mind.
 
JacketFanForLife said:
Are you kidding me? If you run you run block. If you pass you pass block.
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CPJ's O-line is usually smaller and trained completely different blocking skills that traditional schemes. Thought pass blocking may throw wrench into goal unless JN is going to make quick reads/passes.
 
bigsexy1211 said:
Corners crashing is not a good defensive maneuver against the triple option. When we get a Cloud scheme (Corner is force defender), we just switch block and send the slot back to the corner. If they fire the corner, it makes for a relatively easy kick block or cut block. If the block is made, it will be a touchdown more often than not.
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If I recall Duke did this and we adjusted, and got big gains, after they blew up a play or two.

I was there, and haven't seen the replay, so I might have misread it, but I think we adopted the blocking scheme you described when Duke did that.
 
PJ_RULZ said:
CPJ's O-line is usually smaller and trained completely different blocking skills that traditional schemes. Thought pass blocking may throw wrench into goal unless JN is going to make quick reads/passes.
Click to expand...
That is a good point. I guess it could call for some different type of pass blocking techniques. The kind of passes that we need to be throwing are the type that will not require a sustained pass block anyway.
 
I see the our potential use of the shotgun principally as another way to get the A backs the ball wide/in space on flair routes. In order for this work we'll keep defenses honest with some runs & deep throws out of the formation.

What I don't know is if we'll run any zone read triple option, which could be pretty cool.

All this said, PJ's a big believer in doing a few things very, very, well. We'll have to run the gun well in practice or it will never see the light of day.
 
ElTechelero said:
I see the our potential use of the shotgun principally as another way to get the A backs the ball wide/in space on flair routes. In order for this work we'll keep defenses honest with some runs & deep throws out of the formation.

What I don't know is if we'll run any zone read triple option, which could be pretty cool.

All this said, PJ's a big believer in doing a few things very, very, well. We'll have to run the gun well in practice or it will never see the light of day.
Click to expand...

I only see it being used at the end of a game when we're behind and must throw the ball. I'll be surprised to even see that to be honest.
 
When the O-line does pass protect, it will usually be some type of slide protection for the rollout. But in the shotgun to incorporate the crossing/vertical routes you will see pack protection (C,G,T blocking the strongside, G,T blocking the weakside, B-back blocking weakside A gap). Expect to see a lot tunnel screens and the TO from the shotgun
 
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