"Tech Football loses at least 4 more scollys" AJC
- Thread starter bobby dodds ghost
- Start date
Re: it started in 2001
I guess from your remarks we been cheating for the better part of 5 years. So then why did this problem surface recently? I never said that CCG was guilty! But some of you guys will say anything to try to make my statements anti CCG. Maybe if we had our full alotment of coaches we would have another person to look at the SA's progress to a degree.
I do believe we have a new academic advisor who came on board after Carol correct? Where was he/she (I know who it is) and why is that person silent? Is he not the one who should be speaking also? As per your statement that this has been debated endlessly, then why in hades was something not done about it before it becomes a full fledge NCAA investigation?
I guess from your remarks we been cheating for the better part of 5 years. So then why did this problem surface recently? I never said that CCG was guilty! But some of you guys will say anything to try to make my statements anti CCG. Maybe if we had our full alotment of coaches we would have another person to look at the SA's progress to a degree.
I do believe we have a new academic advisor who came on board after Carol correct? Where was he/she (I know who it is) and why is that person silent? Is he not the one who should be speaking also? As per your statement that this has been debated endlessly, then why in hades was something not done about it before it becomes a full fledge NCAA investigation?
If we\'re certifying approximately 350-400 athletes
a year, and these violations took place over a 4-5 year period, I'd hardly qualify 17 inelligibles as "cheating." Bad mistake? Yeah. Are we going to pay for it? You bet. Cheating? Even the NCAA doesn't agree with that...
As far as the rest of your post goes, how many coaches do we have? How many are we allowed to have?
Jim Stevens, who took over for CM, has retired. The new director starts work at the end of May. I'm way less interested in hearing from Stevens or anyone in the AA than I am in hearing from the CERTIFYING OFFICER--the GT registrar! I bet she could explain how this happened.
a year, and these violations took place over a 4-5 year period, I'd hardly qualify 17 inelligibles as "cheating." Bad mistake? Yeah. Are we going to pay for it? You bet. Cheating? Even the NCAA doesn't agree with that...
As far as the rest of your post goes, how many coaches do we have? How many are we allowed to have?
Jim Stevens, who took over for CM, has retired. The new director starts work at the end of May. I'm way less interested in hearing from Stevens or anyone in the AA than I am in hearing from the CERTIFYING OFFICER--the GT registrar! I bet she could explain how this happened.
Re: it started in 2001
OF, I don't classify this as cheating I call it being stupid. I have yet to see anything that would suggest any of these athletes was actually ineligible after the paperwork was corrected. Those who were in place when it was going on are gone IIRC. We have a new Registrar and will soon have our second new academic advisor. C Moore was in place for part of this and you can bet we won't hear a word from her. It's also unclear whether the problem was all there or whether the Registrar's office screwed up some of it. I don't know that Braine is fully responsible, meaning all those involved work for GTAA. I think that's where some of the institutional control language comes from. If the Registrar's office didn't know what they were doing it's outside of GTAA's control.
As to the NCAA investigation, people are acting like this is something new. We've known this was going on since early 2004 and have been waiting for them to finish. Yes it's bad news and worse than we expected. But's it's not really new news as it's the final stages of something that's been going on for over a year investigating stuff that happened from '99 to '03 (best I can tell).
BTW, you're the one who brough Chan into this, not me. I was simply letting you know that there's no way this one can be pinned on him. My comment on coaches was TIC. We do have our full allotment of coaches and they are not supposed to dig into student records. My point was that if they were totally responsible for academic progress we would need many more to keep up with the detail of that many SAs. But it's not their responsibility and shouldn't be IMO. They should know the kids are going to class and staying eligible and that's it. And they know they're eligible because the academic staff and Registrar certifies it.
OF, I don't classify this as cheating I call it being stupid. I have yet to see anything that would suggest any of these athletes was actually ineligible after the paperwork was corrected. Those who were in place when it was going on are gone IIRC. We have a new Registrar and will soon have our second new academic advisor. C Moore was in place for part of this and you can bet we won't hear a word from her. It's also unclear whether the problem was all there or whether the Registrar's office screwed up some of it. I don't know that Braine is fully responsible, meaning all those involved work for GTAA. I think that's where some of the institutional control language comes from. If the Registrar's office didn't know what they were doing it's outside of GTAA's control.
As to the NCAA investigation, people are acting like this is something new. We've known this was going on since early 2004 and have been waiting for them to finish. Yes it's bad news and worse than we expected. But's it's not really new news as it's the final stages of something that's been going on for over a year investigating stuff that happened from '99 to '03 (best I can tell).
BTW, you're the one who brough Chan into this, not me. I was simply letting you know that there's no way this one can be pinned on him. My comment on coaches was TIC. We do have our full allotment of coaches and they are not supposed to dig into student records. My point was that if they were totally responsible for academic progress we would need many more to keep up with the detail of that many SAs. But it's not their responsibility and shouldn't be IMO. They should know the kids are going to class and staying eligible and that's it. And they know they're eligible because the academic staff and Registrar certifies it.
Re: it started in 2001
OK, you guys are correct. No one is to blame, all are as innocent as new born babes. This is just a bad dream we are all having. So lets forget the NCAA, lets forget the higher ups. Heck lets just forget everything as I said this is just a collective bad dream we are all having.
We will have a stellar years win the MNC, CCG named coach of the year, Braine named AD of the year and Clough named pres of the year. NCAA declares a paper work snafu nothing more.
OK, you guys are correct. No one is to blame, all are as innocent as new born babes. This is just a bad dream we are all having. So lets forget the NCAA, lets forget the higher ups. Heck lets just forget everything as I said this is just a collective bad dream we are all having.
We will have a stellar years win the MNC, CCG named coach of the year, Braine named AD of the year and Clough named pres of the year. NCAA declares a paper work snafu nothing more.
Re: it started in 2001
That's just a dumb post of. Who has said noone is to blame? What most people are saying is that we don't know who is to blame yet because we don't know the details. I agree that if we find it was under Braine's area or responsibility he should get the boot. But the FACT is that at this point it does appear to be stupidity on someone's fault in handling the paperwork involved with keeping players eligible and/or ensuring they were eligible. There has been NO evidence presented that any of those players were really eligible if their paperwork had been handled properly. If it comes out that something was done to keep players eligible who weren't actually THEN you can talk about cheating.
That's just a dumb post of. Who has said noone is to blame? What most people are saying is that we don't know who is to blame yet because we don't know the details. I agree that if we find it was under Braine's area or responsibility he should get the boot. But the FACT is that at this point it does appear to be stupidity on someone's fault in handling the paperwork involved with keeping players eligible and/or ensuring they were eligible. There has been NO evidence presented that any of those players were really eligible if their paperwork had been handled properly. If it comes out that something was done to keep players eligible who weren't actually THEN you can talk about cheating.
Re: it started in 2001
Pray tell why was that a stupid post? 1st off you said Clough was not responsible, then you said Braine is not responsible, others including me have said that CCG is most likely not responsible. That leaves some under paid, low level clerk responsible. Who does that person ultimately report to maybe Braine then Clough. When I managed and a person no matter how low failed in a task the blame ultimately came to me. So what the heck is the difference? Did Braine lie, when he said it was self reported? Did he lie about anything? Gees will the truth ever be know? YOU and I and all here on this board do not know. May never know who is the ultimate responsible person or persons. So lets just forget it it's a bad dream thats all.
I did not introduce CCG into this thread, read posts that were written prior to my 1st post. Do I need to set up a 101 remedial reading course. I of course will make it cheap for all Tech graduates.
Now enough, no one is responsible, and the NCAA is not looking at us, nor is anyone else.
Pray tell why was that a stupid post? 1st off you said Clough was not responsible, then you said Braine is not responsible, others including me have said that CCG is most likely not responsible. That leaves some under paid, low level clerk responsible. Who does that person ultimately report to maybe Braine then Clough. When I managed and a person no matter how low failed in a task the blame ultimately came to me. So what the heck is the difference? Did Braine lie, when he said it was self reported? Did he lie about anything? Gees will the truth ever be know? YOU and I and all here on this board do not know. May never know who is the ultimate responsible person or persons. So lets just forget it it's a bad dream thats all.
I did not introduce CCG into this thread, read posts that were written prior to my 1st post. Do I need to set up a 101 remedial reading course. I of course will make it cheap for all Tech graduates.
Now enough, no one is responsible, and the NCAA is not looking at us, nor is anyone else.
Re: it started in 2001
You're the one who needs to reread this thread OF. Maybe you're confusing it with another one. You first mention CG in the third post of the thread. Any comments after that are in reference to yours.
You'll have to quote me where I said anyone wasn't responsible. I said perhaps Braine isn't totally responsible. I also mention C Moore, Clough and the Registrar's office. You're right, whoever was responsible for those who made the errors is responsible. If you can tell me who that is then we'll agree on who should take the bullet. I agree that Tech needs to come clean and it does look like Braine has misled us. I just wonder when he's put on the spot about self reporting if he's going to say we reported it to the ACC. Don't know that that counts for anything but I do remember seeing it in an article somewhere.
What I don't understand about you though is that when people say WTTE "when we find out who was responsible they should be fired" you take that to mean a belief that no one is responsible and no one should pay the price? Do you mind if we get it right first?
You're the one who needs to reread this thread OF. Maybe you're confusing it with another one. You first mention CG in the third post of the thread. Any comments after that are in reference to yours.
You'll have to quote me where I said anyone wasn't responsible. I said perhaps Braine isn't totally responsible. I also mention C Moore, Clough and the Registrar's office. You're right, whoever was responsible for those who made the errors is responsible. If you can tell me who that is then we'll agree on who should take the bullet. I agree that Tech needs to come clean and it does look like Braine has misled us. I just wonder when he's put on the spot about self reporting if he's going to say we reported it to the ACC. Don't know that that counts for anything but I do remember seeing it in an article somewhere.
What I don't understand about you though is that when people say WTTE "when we find out who was responsible they should be fired" you take that to mean a belief that no one is responsible and no one should pay the price? Do you mind if we get it right first?
FHstinger
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Re: it started in 2001
I don't pay any attention to oldfoggy posts anymore, and have been ignoring them for a while now. He just told an untruth when he said he didn't bring up Chan the Man in this thread. Oldfoggy is just using this story to bash CCG again imho.
Go on back to BuzzOff oldfoggy, and quit poisoning this board. Oh, and take tml and bibb stinger with ye.
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I don't pay any attention to oldfoggy posts anymore, and have been ignoring them for a while now. He just told an untruth when he said he didn't bring up Chan the Man in this thread. Oldfoggy is just using this story to bash CCG again imho.
Go on back to BuzzOff oldfoggy, and quit poisoning this board. Oh, and take tml and bibb stinger with ye.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbdn.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbdn.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbdn.gif
Re: it started in 2001
I did in fact mention CCG but that was in reference to the fact that Braine, Clough etc some one is responsible. But since no one is responsible lets just sweep it under the rug and forget it.
As for you fsstinker, Get to Buzzoff is that all you can say, guess so since you and your ilk can say nothing else. DON'T read my posts, like I seldom read yours. Since this board has become what it has become I suggest you look in the mirror. I'll also tell you get to the HIVE where they are having all the love fest you can handle.
I did in fact mention CCG but that was in reference to the fact that Braine, Clough etc some one is responsible. But since no one is responsible lets just sweep it under the rug and forget it.
As for you fsstinker, Get to Buzzoff is that all you can say, guess so since you and your ilk can say nothing else. DON'T read my posts, like I seldom read yours. Since this board has become what it has become I suggest you look in the mirror. I'll also tell you get to the HIVE where they are having all the love fest you can handle.
well said old foggy
This is all just a bad dream. The NCAA isn't mad at us at all. They just used the term "Lack of Institutional Control" to be funny. Only this joke is much more funnier and the punch line comes with 24 scholarship reductions.
That Miles Brand he is such a rascal.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif
This is all just a bad dream. The NCAA isn't mad at us at all. They just used the term "Lack of Institutional Control" to be funny. Only this joke is much more funnier and the punch line comes with 24 scholarship reductions.
That Miles Brand he is such a rascal.
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bs.gif
JJacket
Declared dead for tax purposes.
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Re: disagree on one key item
Well, at least OF finally has a post I agree with. Reminds me of the time I took a job and was told by the interviewer how wonderful everything was at the company. Took me about two weeks to find out what a train wreck the place was and hit the road. Chan, likewise, has to be wondering what those two clowns above him are doing with their time - fly fishing? - and that he may have been sold a bill of goods.
I am worried that maybe they have known since hiring Chan that something like this was going to happen. Why else would they forbid the coaches from getting involved in the academic affairs of their players? Afraid someone may find out what a bunch of boobs run the academic offices? Did GOL's intimidating presence have anything to do with this mess? Not specifically blaming it on him or saying he ordered it done, but perhaps things were "hidden" by advisors to avoid his wrath.
Well, at least OF finally has a post I agree with. Reminds me of the time I took a job and was told by the interviewer how wonderful everything was at the company. Took me about two weeks to find out what a train wreck the place was and hit the road. Chan, likewise, has to be wondering what those two clowns above him are doing with their time - fly fishing? - and that he may have been sold a bill of goods.
I am worried that maybe they have known since hiring Chan that something like this was going to happen. Why else would they forbid the coaches from getting involved in the academic affairs of their players? Afraid someone may find out what a bunch of boobs run the academic offices? Did GOL's intimidating presence have anything to do with this mess? Not specifically blaming it on him or saying he ordered it done, but perhaps things were "hidden" by advisors to avoid his wrath.
TerminusTechie
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Rationale for Academic Control
The reason for removing the interaction of coaches with professors is to avoid any potential pressure from coaches on professors to assign certain grade results for student-athletes.
I think this is the correct organizational choice to avoid potential scandals of coaches trying to gain academic favoritism for athletes. However, the coaches should receive reports on the academic progress of athletes so that the coaches can apply pressure on the athletes to work harder on their academics.
UGA's problem with Harrick Jr. was exactly because of the conflicts of interest between athletic associations and academics. Procedural walls can and should be created to avoid such conflicts of interest in a university and its athletic association. Still GT's coach needs to know the status of his athletes (perhaps as often as weekly or bi-weekly) to proactively intervene to help the studies of an academically struggling athlete with additional tutors, more study time, and other methods to ethically improve a student-athlete's educational performance.
The reason for removing the interaction of coaches with professors is to avoid any potential pressure from coaches on professors to assign certain grade results for student-athletes.
I think this is the correct organizational choice to avoid potential scandals of coaches trying to gain academic favoritism for athletes. However, the coaches should receive reports on the academic progress of athletes so that the coaches can apply pressure on the athletes to work harder on their academics.
UGA's problem with Harrick Jr. was exactly because of the conflicts of interest between athletic associations and academics. Procedural walls can and should be created to avoid such conflicts of interest in a university and its athletic association. Still GT's coach needs to know the status of his athletes (perhaps as often as weekly or bi-weekly) to proactively intervene to help the studies of an academically struggling athlete with additional tutors, more study time, and other methods to ethically improve a student-athlete's educational performance.