The Falcons must drop Vick, whether he's innocent or not

[beej67]

Short Term:

Vick will not be able to play this year, due to legal time constraints. Innocent or guilty, no matter what, the Falcons will not have access to him this year, so there is no point in giving him any reps in practice. We're stuck with Joey Harrington, so we need to get him as many reps as possible now, period.

Long Term:

The #1 most important thing for a QB to be able to do is make good decisions. That's his job. It's the most important thing in his job description. Everything we've seen from Vick, both on and off the field, speaks to the fact that he's got amazing talent and poor decision making ability. Whether he's innocent or guilty of this dog fighting deal is irrelevant, because he's shown that he doesn't have the qualifications to be an NFL quarterback, by his poor decisions.

 

[ContactBuzz]

Short Term:

Vick will not be able to play this year, due to legal time constraints. Innocent or guilty, no matter what, the Falcons will not have access to him this year, so there is no point in giving him any reps in practice. We're stuck with Joey Harrington, so we need to get him as many reps as possible now, period.

Long Term:

The #1 most important thing for a QB to be able to do is make good decisions. That's his job. It's the most important thing in his job description. Everything we've seen from Vick, both on and off the field, speaks to the fact that he's got amazing talent and poor decision making ability. Whether he's innocent or guilty of this dog fighting deal is irrelevant, because he's shown that he doesn't have the qualifications to be an NFL quarterback, by his poor decisions.

What about the salary cap implications? If he is released, all of his guaranteed signing bonus ($24M remains) that has been prorated over the life of the contract moves to the front for salary cap purposes - $15M this year, $9M next (the NFL cap for 2007 is ~$109M). The Falcons would have to waive other players (or do some serious contract renegotiatons) to make this happen.

The right thing to do from a business standpoint is to keep him. I think it's the right thing to do from a personnel standpoint as well - it will certainly be a distraction in the short term but I think he'll be able to play (although practice time could be problem). The organization can also let the justice system run it's course and then make a decision based upon the results. This season could be uncomfortable but I'm pretty sure we'll have closure before the start of next season.

 

[refrigeratormover]

What about the salary cap implications? If he is released, all of his guaranteed signing bonus ($24M remains) that has been prorated over the life of the contract moves to the front for salary cap purposes - $15M this year, $9M next (the NFL cap for 2007 is ~$109M). The Falcons would have to waive other players (or do some serious contract renegotiatons) to make this happen.

The right thing to do from a business standpoint is to keep him. I think it's the right thing to do from a personnel standpoint as well - it will certainly be a distraction in the short term but I think he'll be able to play (although practice time could be problem). The organization can also let the justice system run it's course and then make a decision based upon the results. This season could be uncomfortable but I'm pretty sure we'll have closure before the start of next season.

This is just a guess on my part but I think Blank is talking with the league right now about salaray implications of their salary cap and what options they might have.

When signing vick the falcons really didn't know what they were getting as a lot of other teams don't either. ( you can test them all you want ) I believe Blank will apply for hardship to the league just as the other teams might as well, such as Chicago or Tennessee.

I heard that vick is supposed to get a bonus for showing up on time to camp this year and it's not going to happen because he has to be in court. I don't know if that's true but just what I have heard on sports and news radio.

The falcons shouldn't be punished and hit hard with the cap. Goddell definitely has had some challenges early on but I think he has done a good job.

You have to suspend Vick NOW or let Henry and Pricman back on the team.

By the way can you imagine what PETA is going to do on game days home and away? That would be enough for me to cut ties with vick.

 

[ContactBuzz]

The falcons shouldn't be punished and hit hard with the cap. Goddell definitely has had some challenges early on but I think he has done a good job.

I'm a Falcons fan / NFL fan but I disagree - if the NFL loosens the salary cap restrictions because of behavioral / legal issues, they'll be going down a slippery slope. The salary cap is in place mainly to even the playing field so smaller/mid market teams have the same opportunity to compete as the large market teams. But it (and it's associated rules & restrictions) is also in place to keep the teams responsible for how they spend - a check & balance to avoid "A-Rod"-like contracts.

If the NFL is serious about it's conduct policy, they will not grant any salary cap exceptions based on the Vick, Pacman, Tank Johnson, or Chris Henry situations. I know you can't always predict these outcomes (players and potential legal problems down the road) but the teams need to do as much due dilligence as possible to try to avoid them. One More Edit: Bottom line, teams shouldn't be excused from making poor business decisions - which looks to be the case here.

You have to suspend Vick NOW or let Henry and Pricman back on the team.

That's not an Arthur Blank decision - there does appear to be some sort of a double standard (if you disregard the fact that Henry and Pacman are consistently in trouble with the law). That's a Goodell issue and he has apparently decided that Vick deserves more good will than the other 2...

 

[refrigeratormover]

All good points.

 

[romegajacket]

I'm am neither defending or condemming Vick's actions since he hasn't been tried yet, if he gets tried at all. I will say the whole matter of dog fighting makes my drawers feel like coarse sandpaper.
If Vick is guilty, and taking into consideration that "political correctness" seems to be the forefront of any and all business decisions today, the Falcons will most likely be backed in a corner and Vick will be punished in some way. You fellas will know a lot more than I about what can happen in that case. But this "political correctness" crap that seems to govern in the US today will most likely prevail no matter what.

 

[ContactBuzz]

By the way, I answered why the Falcons can't take action but I didn't answer what I think should happen: I think Vick taking a voluntary paid LOA is the best for all parties. If he's really apologetic about the circus that has been created (as reported) then he shouldn't mind stepping aside and letting everything play out.

 

[ContactBuzz]

I'm am neither defending or condemming Vick's actions since he hasn't been tried yet, if he gets tried at all. I will say the whole matter of dog fighting makes my drawers feel like coarse sandpaper.
If Vick is guilty, and taking into consideration that "political correctness" seems to be the forefront of any and all business decisions today, the Falcons will most likely be backed in a corner and Vick will be punished in some way. You fellas will know a lot more than I about what can happen in that case. But this "political correctness" crap that seems to govern in the US today will most likely prevail no matter what.

It's funny that you mention political correctness - this is a strange circumstance where you have a minority high profile athlete being named in a case of animal cruelty. There's a letter from PETA, the Humane Society, and other animal rights groups co-signed by Russell Simmons and Al Sharpton. Strange to see Sharpton take a stance against Vick (even though the letter is carefully worded in how and when they use his name)

 

[Leatherjacket]

I'm am neither defending or condemming Vick's actions since he hasn't been tried yet, if he gets tried at all. I will say the whole matter of dog fighting makes my drawers feel like coarse sandpaper.
If Vick is guilty, and taking into consideration that "political correctness" seems to be the forefront of any and all business decisions today, the Falcons will most likely be backed in a corner and Vick will be punished in some way. You fellas will know a lot more than I about what can happen in that case. But this "political correctness" crap that seems to govern in the US today will most likely prevail no matter what.

Political Correctness has NOTHING to do with this case.
Dog fighting is a hangover from the DARK AGES of humanity.
It needs to be stamped out TOTALLY and with a VENGEANCE.
If you can't see that, you need to examine your own humanity!

 

[BarrelORum]

I'm a Falcons fan / NFL fan but I disagree - if the NFL loosens the salary cap restrictions because of behavioral / legal issues, they'll be going down a slippery slope..

I gotta agree with this. It puts pressure on the team to draft and trade responsibly and stress a priority on players having higher character values.

If you do this your just giving the team outs to keep recycling players through the league that are an stain on the league.

 

[BarrelORum]

I'm am neither defending or condemming Vick's actions since he hasn't been tried yet, if he gets tried at all. I will say the whole matter of dog fighting makes my drawers feel like coarse sandpaper.
If Vick is guilty, and taking into consideration that "political correctness" seems to be the forefront of any and all business decisions today, the Falcons will most likely be backed in a corner and Vick will be punished in some way. You fellas will know a lot more than I about what can happen in that case. But this "political correctness" crap that seems to govern in the US today will most likely prevail no matter what.

If he's guilty, his judgement has nothing to do with "political correctness". The guy was running a death camp for dogs. How does that sound to you?

If he's guilty, they need to tie him down in a pit with steaks covering his body and release about 5 starving pit bulls. The punishment should reflect the crime.

 

[romegajacket]

If he's guilty, his judgement has nothing to do with "political correctness". The guy was running a death camp for dogs. How does that sound to you?

If he's guilty, they need to tie him down in a pit with steaks covering his body and release about 5 starving pit bulls. The punishment should reflect the crime.

Disagree,
"Political correctness"....... has a lot to do with MUCH today and it can enter here too. Judges are politicians too.

If guilty......,
No problem with that statement. Matter of fact, if it were held in the front yard of the court house, with 7 days notice in the legal ads, I wouldn't mind.

 

[refrigeratormover]

Just heard on the cowherd show that all parties are meeting now to discuss the voluntary leave for vick, problem is, is that vick has to agree with it.

 

[Buzzfan]

JD, what would the NFLPA's stance on this be, iyo?

 

[aeromech]

I have some pity for Blank

When signing vick the falcons really didn't know what they were getting as a lot of other teams don't either. ( you can test them all you want ) I believe Blank will apply for hardship to the league just as the other teams might as well, such as Chicago or Tennessee.

Note I said "some" pity'. He paid huge amount of money trying to bring a winner to Atlanta and it is blowing up in his face. One thing you could count on with Rankin Smith, he would have never got himself wrapped up in a huge contract.

If you're the Falcons owner you know it is going to be a bad season when:

a) Jay Leno starts out his monologue talking about your franchise quarterback for his off the field antics.

b) Nancy Grace starts out: "Tonight we will be talking about the Atlanta Falcons NFL Team's Quarterback..."

c) A former Ku Klux Klan member stands up in front of the US Senate and calls your franchise player "Barbaric, Barbaric, BARBARIC!!"

This stuff is getting even more national attention than I ever thought it would. National attention yes, the opening story for Nancy Grace, that was a surprise as was Senator Byrd's remarks in the Senate.

Given the high profile of this case, the Falcons or the NFL has got to get Vick off the field. The Falcons marquee talent is tarnishing the entire league. Someone, probably Blank, is going to have to pay the financial bullet and say enough is too much. Vick is hurting more than the team, he is hurting the market, and at least half his pay must have been for his marketability.

Blank is making mistakes as an owner similar to Turner in the early years with the Braves. He is willing to buy a winner, he just doesn't know how; but bless his heart he is trying, and I think eventually he'll learn, just like Ted did.

 

[aeromech]

Quote:
Originally Posted by BarrelORum
If he's guilty, his judgement has nothing to do with "political correctness". The guy was running a death camp for dogs. How does that sound to you?

If he's guilty, they need to tie him down in a pit with steaks covering his body and release about 5 starving pit bulls. The punishment should reflect the crime.

Disagree,

Disagree,
"Political correctness"....... has a lot to do with MUCH today and it can enter here too. Judges are politicians too.

If guilty......,
No problem with that statement. Matter of fact, if it were held in the front yard of the court house, with 7 days notice in the legal ads, I wouldn't mind.

So let me see if I understand this. You think people who participate in dog fighting are cruel and barbaric; but you would advocate publically having someone ripped apart by dogs.

 

[refrigeratormover]

JD, what would the NFLPA's stance on this be, iyo?

I think this is a case that for once upshaw who I despise will have to meet with gooddell and find common ground to resolve the next step and then move forward.

I for one if were still playing would vote for a LOA because of the huge distraction and chances are the guys I played with would vote the same.

I wouldn't want to be around the protest's all the time the whole season every where I went. It's going to be a nightmare.

 

[romegajacket]

Quote:
Originally Posted by BarrelORum
If he's guilty, his judgement has nothing to do with "political correctness". The guy was running a death camp for dogs. How does that sound to you?

If he's guilty, they need to tie him down in a pit with steaks covering his body and release about 5 starving pit bulls. The punishment should reflect the crime.

Disagree,


So let me see if I understand this. You think people who participate in dog fighting are cruel and barbaric; but you would advocate publically having someone ripped apart by dogs.

To that sir I say, get a grip on yourself.
Try really hard and I think you can understand what I posted. Nothing more, nothing less, unless one's mind has a tendency to............................

 

[aeromech]

To that sir I say, get a grip on yourself.
Try really hard and I think you can understand what I posted. Nothing more, nothing less, unless one's mind has a tendency to............................

I think we all need to get a grip. I personally find what M. Vick allegedly did abhorrent; but I think that 1-5 at the state pen would be sufficient. With the prison overcrowding we have these days I would not risk parolling a rapist, child molester, or drug dealer, to put Vick away for 10-20. As bad as abusing animals is, it is far below abusing humans in my book.

 

[77GTFan]

After last season Vick had decent trade value. Schaub could have been given a chance to start. A draft pick could have been used for a QB.

I fault the Falcons for not knowing Michael Vick well enough to predict this kind of outcome. Now, Schaub is gone, Vick's trade value is non-existent, and the Falcons QB could serve time. At the very least the Falcons have a QB that is a public relations nightmare who takes up a lot of cap space.

Yes, hindsight is 20/20. But, good NFL franchises have good foresight when it comes to their personnel.