You guys act like we have a PROGRAM...

T

The Gnome of Zurich

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And I mean a P R O G R A M!! Get real and get used to it. The last time I looked, we had won 9 games or more in a season only 4 or 5 times in the last 30- 40 years. Real Football Programs are disgraced if they dont win 9 (ie Nebraska) So for starters 6-8 wins is as good as we will be on average and every half century we may win 9-10. That should be the expectations of all of us. So at Georgia Tech we should expect a good season to be 6 wins or more on average. But we should lso expect the coach at GT to be a disciplinarian because of our academics and his coaching philosophy to be very wide open on offense. We will never win consistently without a similar style to Friedgens offense because we will never have the massive lineman of an Ohio State to plod along and run the ball. Well, get used to some bad football because our expectations and coaching philosophy are at a crossroads and they have obviously taken the wrong raod. I hope I am wrong but I'm afraid we need to all lower our expectations because nothing is going to change as far as the administration. I just wish we had an AD who understood 1) what the TOTAL PERSON Concept is all about 2) what type of Coach we really need at GT. And a President who understood 1) MIT doesnt have DIV 1 sports 2) Carnegie Mellon doesnt have Div 1 Sports 3) Stanford does. At least there would be hope...Enough of my rambling.
 
The Gnome of Zurich. You are correct about a couple of things, but in my opinion wrong about one of them.

As shown in the Dodd and Friegden years, you can win consistently at Tech with an offense that relies on passing, trickery, wide open football and a defense that is smart and fast.

Dodd and Friegden were masters of deception with the offenses. They confused the defense rather than trying to consistently overpower it. You do not dump the idea of trying to overpower the defense at times, but you keep it off balance so it is penetrable.

If you do not have the overpowering defensive linemen, you need quick linemen and smart, fast defensive backfields. You have to adjust to your materials.

Dodd proved we could win with Tech materials in the past, and Friegden proved we could, recently, when he coached the offense for Ross and O'Leary.

I believe you are correct that we can not play smash mouth consistently with the big boys, we have to recruit the right type of players for Tech and use our smarts.

I believe you are also correct that Tech has to have the right type of coach that understands it takes a different set of techniques to win at Tech. It can be done.

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Good points. A little pessimistic but logical.

As a long time Techfan I don't subscribe to the "can't win" theories concerning not being Nebraska, Ohio State, Alabama, FSU, on and on.
We can win and we've proven it. Our row is a tougher to plow but it's always been that way and most likely always will be. The "right" coach and the "right" AD, etc. are valid concerns though. We can't afford to not pay attention to "the program."

As far as the wide open Friedgen offense goes I disagree that that is a "must have." Ralph's offense was one of the best but Ralph is a football genius of sorts and those guys are very rare. Trying to conduct that type of offense without a maestro can be disasterous. It's more realistic to start with a basic offense and embellish from there which I think we'll keep doing. I think it's still better to try and establish the running game and play ball control unless of course you've got somebody like Fridge which we'll probably never see again (it was awful nice while it lasted though). I DO NOT like the 4 wide set, RedGun based type of offense.

Good post and welcome aboard!
 
To me it's pretty simply. Somebody tell me that last time Tech had a good team without outstanding QB play. We ran different schemes for Dewberry, Jones and JoeHam and even slightly different with Goose. But the bottom line was that we were unpredictable and relied on the QB to make the right read and execute the play. That's what we missed last year. No matter what the injuries, change of coaches, supposed lack of discipline, etc, did if we had gotten good play from one of our QBs we would have won 9 IMO. And this year will be no different.
 
Good post NCJacket. I do enjoy your take on GT football.

It all comes down to QB play. Of course we need to have SOME kind of overall depth to compete, but the effective play of QB is CRUCIAL!
 
"Irrational idealism seldom withstands the crucible of reality." A good quote from the Water Cooler directed at some our bedwetting liberals who can't/won't accept the sad reality of the need for war. The quote is appropriate here as well in that; trickery/speed without size/smarts without speed and athelticism/schemes/good play calling etc. will seldom withstand the opposition's large number of big/strong/fast/atheltic/talented players. Dodd had quite a number of talented players as reflected in his no. of AA's and Pro's, and yes RF had good but not great talent too. Unfortunately the D was never as well stocked.

I agree with nc's comments though about the QB play and unpredictable play calling, especially on 1st down. The bottom line IMO is there are no shortcuts. THWG
 
I agree with the comments regarding what has worked at Tech- and what will work and always should work- Deception and execution. Friedgen really has about a core of 25 plays- but he has 4 different sets for each play- and you are right- the QB has to make the read. Well, you have to have a good QB and a good teacher who can help make a Scott O'Brien or Goose a better QB than anyone thought. But I'll still go back to discipline as a huge factor in their success. Friedgen as a teacher doesnt accept failure. Repetition is critical. Well, the philosophy at Tech should always be the same. Discipline leads to execution, and if you can execute you can decieve and keep them off balance. We dont have that philosophy right now and it's painful to watch. I am not saying there are many like Friedgen but there are coaches with the same philosophy and at least we can have the right philosophy to get those 6- 7 wins. We do not have that right now. I would be just fine if I thought we were being coached to our abilities, I guess we will see in our renovated stadium.
 
No flame Gnome, but your statement that 6-8 wins and 9 or 10 every half century, is what we SHOULD expect, just could be true for the powers to be as well as a significant percentage of the fan base, and THIS is what scares the hell out of me because if it's true then we damned well will never exceed these lowly expectations. THWG
 
Originally posted by ncjacket:
To me it's pretty simply. Somebody tell me that last time Tech had a good team without outstanding QB play. We ran different schemes for Dewberry, Jones and JoeHam and even slightly different with Goose. But the bottom line was that we were unpredictable and relied on the QB to make the right read and execute the play. That's what we missed last year. No matter what the injuries, change of coaches, supposed lack of discipline, etc, did if we had gotten good play from one of our QBs we would have won 9 IMO. And this year will be no different.
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<font size="2" face="Arial, Verdana, Sans-Serif">Today and in thr foreseeable future, say 10 years, just how may of these quarterbacks do you think will come down the Div 1A pike?

How many will find themseves at Tech?

One every 10 years, 20 years, 30 years?
 
Nine or ten win seasons?? Try 4 times in 17 years ('85,'90,'98,'00) I would tend to think that that would be the norm with the facilities that we have had in place the past twenty years.
 
NCJ - You are spot on about the QB play allowing you to run schemes which hide a lack of smashmouth ability. I would extend your comment and the ones about Dodd to say that if I had the QB situation we have right now and an expected fairly strong Defense I would do exactly what we are hearing out of the flats right now. Strip down the playbook to make sure we can execute something, do everything you can to minimize mistakes and turnovers and plan on kicking the ball deep every chance you get.

Same as Dodd's plan - keep it close till the 4th and figure out a way or a turnover to win. Not nearly as exciting as the Fridge was but it is probably the best we have this year.

Oh yea - and work like hell with Bilbo and the other young uns to see who has that potential magic that let's us go back to the wide open good ole days.
 
Sound thinking Y Jacket. I truly feel like we can execute that style with some success this year....IF we have the horses to do it.

We CAN have a decent year!! Don't give up on our boys!!

 
You're right YJ, if our defense is strong enough we can play more conservative and try to stay away from mistakes. IMO that's what Gailey was trying to do last year but we gave up too many points to make if effective. I just don't see us having the firepower to outscore people so we need to shorten the game. If one of the QBs develops we can open things up more. But it will come down to how effective the defense is.
 
I'm going to quote here an inside source I spoke with in February 2002 about what to expect at Tech with the new head coach and the enhancement of the stadium, tougher schedule, etc.:

"George O'Leary built the program and got us to a certain point, Chan will get us to the next level." That person stated what the next level was.

Those on the inside were never looking to stay "status quo", at least not the football affecionados! The conversation I had with that person spoke of ACC Championships and National Champs and being competitive with all in the conference and our rival up the road. That person was not relaying 6-8 or maybe 9 wins a year or an occasional MNC.

I'm afraid that conversation has taken a big turn backwards and the thought in the minds of the football personnel might have taken a big hit after last season and what is happening now with academics and standards. At least those who care about our football program don't believe we can succeed and be better without all the right personnel in place.

I can say now based on this whole academic scenario and what they believe Chan can and cannot do ... feelings about where we head from here, is all about who runs all the different areas (top to bottom) and the human element being put back into place in the AA!

There is a lot of concern!
 
Good post Ms. Tech... and I am afraid that you may be dead on... Braines recent comments in Denver support what you have written, and his comments disturbed me...

I dont buy into the excuses of academics etc.. I do think the limitations on degree selection is a problem, but, I find it hard to believe that in all of the USA we cant find 25 4-stars a year who would want a degree from Tech, and have the ability to graduate .. I have always thought that the Tech administration and fan base have used this as an excuse to underperform...

I would love it if Braine got some heat for his comments in Denver... we should always have high expectations..

Good thread Gnome... and painfully good points as well.
 
So what do you conclude, MsTech? Was your "inside" person not so inside? Or was last year an "abberation," like the flunks? Either he didn't know what he was talking about, or some things happened last year which Vince Lombardi could not have overcome.
 
Originally posted by bellyseries:
So what do you conclude, MsTech? Was your "inside" person not so inside? Or was last year an "abberation," like the flunks? Either he didn't know what he was talking about, or some things happened last year which Vince Lombardi could not have overcome.
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<font size="2" face="Arial, Verdana, Sans-Serif">Belly: The person inside had those feelings then about Chan, do they now - NO; about the program itself the conversation was directed to moving up in the football world and being an impact program all the time. I did not hear or believe that "status quo" was what they in the AA were looking for or wanted. It was enhancement at every level of the program.

As for the "flunks" you mentioned, those that I have spoken with say, it was preventable, things were not given the attention and direction they should have been. All I hear is, "the ball was dropped big time." Heck, the big time $$$ contributors are saying that in the papers. The other prevailing comment from former players - NEVER have they seem this many at one time and with the possibility of more to come after summer school. Sorry Belly, I won't give names but these are all ex-Tech players.

And Belly, as far as x's and o's ... if we had had Vince Lombardi - can you say 9 or 10 wins with discipline, character and not giving up!!!!
 
Coleman Rudolph, John Davis, and Nate Stimson, to name 3, have gone public with their opinions, and they are very angry at those in charge. I am not going to differ with those guys.
 
I read that we need effective quarterback play to be successful. Heck, every team has to have effective quarterback play. Also everyone has to keep the other team off balance. We, and I repeat we are no different than any other school once we hit the field. The teams that execute the best of smart gameplans plus the dicipline to abstain from mistakes such as personal fouls, offsides and such will almost always win. Our talent level has to be sustained at a certain level for the above to work of course, but then again so does everyone else. The current guidelines today for highschool students to graduate are much much higher than they was 20 years ago when I graduated. So students are much better prepared than years ago and it should be easier to recruit and not harder. Defeat starts long before the games are played and as long as we have a president, a athletic director and head coach selling ourselves short, we are going to be beat before we hit the field.
 
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