Wes Durham at it again

killerbuzz42 said:
Self fulfilling prophecy to me implies that there are no real impediments to success at Tech and this is just in our heads. I patently disagree with comparing the Institute 1 to 1 with any other University that plays FBS.

And I think you have to make it clear to the jackasses on local sports radio that we don’t play on a level field with the other regional powers. It’s a fact. They tend to gloss of over it with the Duke/Stanford BS and then just lay it at the feet of ‘well, Tech just sucks. They don’t have any impediments to being good, can’t be THAT hard to recruit to, they just suck’

Also, anyone considering the job who doesn’t understand this is a very difficult place to win, especially in the modern era which I will bound at 2004 for the sake of APR, is going to be in for a rude surprise. Kinda like taking a welding job and in your first day they put you in a helicopter and fly you out to an oil rig, put you in a wetsuit and tell you to go lay a bead in 5k feet of water.
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We do want them to be aware of the difficulties, but I'd rather have the people trying to hire the coach be the ones to inform them about it. Also, we want the coach to understand the details of all that, not necessarily the whole world. To use your analogy, say we tell the welder he's going to be working 5k feet underwater, but we do it with a loudspeaker in front of his house, think there's a chance the rest of the family will be like "don't do it, you'll lose your life (career)"?
 
gtfan088 said:
Even if he's not wrong, I don't really see the value in making these assertions when we're in the midst of a coaching search. Just seems tantamount to saying "If you're considering the Tech job, you should know that it's not well-suited for winning."

At some point these things become a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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That is my point exactly. For being such a "friend of the program", that is a very unhelpful remark (and untrue).
 
MACHETE said:
That is my point exactly. For being such a "friend of the program", that is a very unhelpful remark (and untrue).
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After several people have asked, you still have yet to prove or clarify what is untrue about that statement. Yet you keep saying it. Just because you don't like it, doesn't make it untrue.
 
Dirty Jacket said:
Sometimes the truth hurts. I agree whole heartedly with Todd that we can compete for the playoffs given where we’ve been with Paul. But that doesn’t make Wes wrong. It means that it takes extreme effort to get there for us.
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It has always been a tough job. And for about 50 years it has been a hard job to fill. This hire probably won't be any different. You can already sense the vibe that there isn't exactly a stampede of candidates wanting to be considered. I am an Atlanta native, but I would think having to move to Atlanta might be a drawback. Does the head coach still get a Capitol City Club membership?
 
Yukonwreck said:
It has always been a tough job. And for about 50 years it has been a hard job to fill. This hire probably won't be any different. You can already sense the vibe that there isn't exactly a stampede of candidates wanting to be considered. I am an Atlanta native, but I would think having to move to Atlanta might be a drawback. Does the head coach still get a Capitol City Club membership?
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I think he can pick any club he wants. I know CCG was a member at Cherokee, and actually I thought CPJ was too but I'm not sure.

I don't think this job is hard to fill at all. What makes it hard to fill is usually competition from other programs, but this year we're one of just a few games in town. And the only game in town where the previous coach isn't leaving behind a dumpster fire.
 
killerbuzz42 said:
Self fulfilling prophecy to me implies that there are no real impediments to success at Tech and this is just in our heads. I patently disagree with comparing the Institute 1 to 1 with any other University that plays FBS.

And I think you have to make it clear to the jackasses on local sports radio that we don’t play on a level field with the other regional powers. It’s a fact. They tend to gloss of over it with the Duke/Stanford BS and then just lay it at the feet of ‘well, Tech just sucks. They don’t have any impediments to being good, can’t be THAT hard to recruit to, they just suck’

Also, anyone considering the job who doesn’t understand this is a very difficult place to win, especially in the modern era which I will bound at 2004 for the sake of APR, is going to be in for a rude surprise. Kinda like taking a welding job and in your first day they put you in a helicopter and fly you out to an oil rig, put you in a wetsuit and tell you to go lay a bead in 5k feet of water.
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I'm not arguing that there aren't impediments, and of course any coach who takes the job should have a sense of what these impediments are, but I disagree that these need to be "made clear" to the general public, talking heads, etc. Personally, I'd rather people feel like Tech is a program that can be as successful as any other.

I said "self-fulfilling prophecy" because if you're constantly emphasizing how difficult it is to be successful, then that's the prevailing sentiment people come away with when they think Georgia Tech football. Don't coach at Tech because it's harder to win there. Why play for Tech? It's hard to win there. Then when these kids don't come here, we use that as further proof that Tech is a challenge to sell. We already have enough schools negatively recruiting against us without us doing it to ourselves.
 
Piedmont Driving Club is the club of choice for Tech Men.
 
GTLiebs said:
We do want them to be aware of the difficulties, but I'd rather have the people trying to hire the coach be the ones to inform them about it. Also, we want the coach to understand the details of all that, not necessarily the whole world. To use your analogy, say we tell the welder he's going to be working 5k feet underwater, but we do it with a loudspeaker in front of his house, think there's a chance the rest of the family will be like "don't do it, you'll lose your life (career)"?
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So he would otherwise lie to his family about what his job entails? Haha
 
GoGATech said:
After several people have asked, you still have yet to prove or clarify what is untrue about that statement. Yet you keep saying it. Just because you don't like it, doesn't make it untrue.
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Some of it is about defining the program as we (the stakeholders - alumni and fans) would like to see it. For God's sake, let's not handicap ourselves. Sure there are issues at Tech which we have all talked about too many times. Those are surmountable. But, guys, it is up to us to define the program we want. Wes is putting perpetuating and in fact, worsening, an image of GT that is simply that, an image.
 
gtfan088 said:
I'm not arguing that there aren't impediments, and of course any coach who takes the job should have a sense of what these impediments are, but I disagree that these need to be "made clear" to the general public, talking heads, etc. Personally, I'd rather people feel like Tech is a program that can be as successful as any other.

I said "self-fulfilling prophecy" because if you're constantly emphasizing how difficult it is to be successful, then that's the prevailing sentiment people come away with when they think Georgia Tech football. Don't coach at Tech because it's harder to win there. Why play for Tech? It's hard to win there. Then when these kids don't come here, we use that as further proof that Tech is a challenge to sell. We already have enough schools negatively recruiting against us without us doing it to ourselves.
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It doesn’t need to be emphasized but it needs to be stated and understood especially if the school is to ever feel any pressure from fans/alum about it. No one in the local media will give it any creedance so you get Wes stating the truth. The unfortunate part is that it’s viewed as such a provacative comment that he will now probably keep getting asked to double down on it so to your point it ends up being overemphasized.


In general and only tangential to our conversation it’s wild to watch the conversations on this board in various threads go from academic elitism towards sidewalk fans and the like going on and on about the rigors of GT to ‘school ain’t that hard we should be able to recruit in spite of it’ or at least be able to sell it to the near nonexistent Venn diagram of high caliber athletes interested in higher education.
 
MACHETE said:
Some of it is about defining the program as we (the stakeholders - alumni and fans) would like to see it. For God's sake, let's not handicap ourselves. Sure there are issues at Tech which we have all talked about too many times. Those are surmountable. But, guys, it is up to us to define the program we want. Wes is putting perpetuating and in fact, worsening, an image of GT that is simply that, an image.
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How do we surmount the issues?
 
MACHETE said:
Some of it is about defining the program as we (the stakeholders - alumni and fans) would like to see it. For God's sake, let's not handicap ourselves. Sure there are issues at Tech which we have all talked about too many times. Those are surmountable. But, guys, it is up to us to define the program we want. Wes is putting perpetuating and in fact, worsening, an image of GT that is simply that, an image.
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What's wrong with challenging people to do the difficult? It is very difficult to win here. It's also very rewarding in several ways. Nothing worth doing is easy is one of my mantras.
 
What was Bobby Dodd's opinion about where Georgia Tech stood in the competitive landscape?
 
gtfan088 said:
Even if he's not wrong, I don't really see the value in making these assertions when we're in the midst of a coaching search. Just seems tantamount to saying "If you're considering the Tech job, you should know that it's not well-suited for winning."

At some point these things become a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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so you are saying that a coach was going to take the job but backed out because Wes Durham said it was difficult
giggle.gif
 
BeeStorm said:
was there more gold to be mined there?
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I'm talking about the picture that gets painted about the program when these comments become the norm. No, I don't think any particular coach is turning down our program because of anything Wes Durham has to say. But again, I'm not surprised that that's what you took away. Enjoy your Disney trip.
 
gtfan088 said:
I'm talking about the picture that gets painted about the program when these comments become the norm. No, I don't think any particular coach is turning down our program because of anything Wes Durham has to say. But again, I'm not surprised that that's what you took away. Enjoy your Disney trip.
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Wes isn't saying anything that GOL didn't say...
 
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