Genuine Question

GoGATech

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ok, so we are paying the HC like ACC, but not the rest of the staff.

how does it compare to the MAC salaries?
Of course we're well above the MAC level, so it's not as bad as he made it sound. But we're also very much on the low end of the entire conference, so we need improvement if we want to return to a program capable of competing for conference championships and such.
 

GT98

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Of course we're well above the MAC level, so it's not as bad as he made it sound. But we're also very much on the low end of the entire conference, so we need improvement if we want to return to a program capable of competing for conference championships and such.
Tdope needs to be making this pitch. Some top notch assistants would make Collins look a whole lot better and can strengthen areas that he is not so good at currently.
 

PressManCoverage

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So why aren't places that always recruit well (unc, fsu, ut) currently dominating? If head coaches are just recruiters (since coaches have such parity) and cgc recruits better than cpj, why can't he win more than 3 games yet? Why is UGA always preseason number 1 and never post season #1?
First all you are name dropping schools with big names in the past and distorting the Facts.

Look at the NFL Draft over the last 5-7 yrs and ask yourself has FSU & Tennessee been recruiting well.

You can't just drop the Names Tennessee, FSU, maybe Miami (other posters) and say see they Recruit well, there's a uge difference between having a big name and a currently loaded roster, which those schools don't have

Those places are a shell of what they used to be, the numbers of NFL draftees at all positions across the board are way down at those Colleges compared to their heydey when they were strong in all three phases.

If you don't think Recruiting matters, check our record vs uga since 1970.

You do realize that the Team picked to win the SB before the Season is played almost never wins the SB, so a Team made up of 18 to 23 yr olds is not a guarantee to win it all in college based on media guesses
 

cyptomcat

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Of course we're well above the MAC level, so it's not as bad as he made it sound. But we're also very much on the low end of the entire conference, so we need improvement if we want to return to a program capable of competing for conference championships and such.
We are about the median for ACC for the head coach.

For the whole staff, you didn't list every school, which I understand, the data can be limited. We are probably not very far from the median even if at the low end for that. It can use an improvement for sure.

Collins already has a very long contract, that's not changing next few years. I think we will have more budget for a pay raise for the assistants, of course only the ones who are well-performing. We can even replace others, and increase the spending that way too.
 

GoGATech

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We are about the median for ACC for the head coach.

For the whole staff, you didn't list every school, which I understand, the data can be limited. We are probably not very far from the median even if at the low end for that. It can use an improvement for sure.

Collins already has a very long contract, that's not changing next few years. I think we will have more budget for a pay raise for the assistants, of course only the ones who are well-performing. We can even replace others, and increase the spending that way too.
The ones I left out for staff are private schools that none is listed for, and Pitt. According to what they are paying Narduzzi, I expect Pitt to be in the $7.5-$8M range for full staff. I feel certain Miami is well ahead of us. Syracuse and BC are paying HC nearly the same as us, so they are probably on par with us or ahead with the remaining staff. Then you have Duke and Wake. I would imagine if we could see the figures of all conference schools, Duke and Wake would be the only ones behind us, possibly Syracuse and/or BC. So we are like 10-12 out of 14.
 

PressManCoverage

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If you read my post and believe that was the assertion I was making, I don't think there's hope for productive discourse.
You threw around names from 20 years ago (FSU, Tenn, etc) as if those schools are still recruiting great players, they are not.

Those places are no better than us in the interior LoSs, in case you haven't noticed the 3rd Saturday in October hasn't been close in forever, Olé Miss is closer to Bama than Tennessee.

You throwing around FSU & Tennessee as great recruiting schools is the issue, when anyone that watches the Games knows otherwise.
 

QuadF

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You threw around names from 20 years ago (FSU, Tenn, etc) as if those schools are still recruiting great players, they are not.

Those places are no better than us in the interior LoSs, in case you haven't noticed the 3rd Saturday in October hasn't been close in forever, Olé Miss is closer to Bama than Tennessee.

You throwing around FSU & Tennessee as great recruiting schools is the issue, when anyone that watches the Games knows otherwise.

2019 4 year avg:
Fsu - 15
UT - 17

It's not a rolling average for 2020, but I don't think it skews the results substantially as older players are more likely to play.
 

PressManCoverage

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2019 4 year avg:
Fsu - 15
UT - 17

It's not a rolling average for 2020, but I don't think it skews the results substantially as older players are more likely to play.
Tenn plays 8 games every year in the SEC.

That rolling average would be great in the Big12, but in the SEC there are 6 schools that Recruit better than them each year.

Every yr they play:

UGA
UF
Bama
Auburn (?)
Not sure who they play from the crossover games, but when Half of your Conference out recruits you, you are looking at 4-5 loss seasons before injury & attrition is taken under consideration

Gotta tell both sides of the story.
 

Olgoldandwhie

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Hate to break it to you but that's a great big negative, ghost rider. We have thrown a lot more money at football recently but we are still waaaay behind. These numbers are from 2020. Can't find much data on the private schools so they aren't included with the assistants, but I also don't know how accurate the HC salary is for those either, so I italicized them. Either way, we are well towards the bottom end in all categories. The only category we are close in is OL coach, Brent Key makes $600k, and is the 2nd highest paid OL coach in the conference. He also holds the title of "Assistant Head Coach/Run Game Coordinator." For some reason Pitt's assistant coach salary data was not available either, but based on their HC salary, I would imagine their total salary is somewhere in the range of Louisville/Virginia.

ACC Public University Salaries:

Head Coach:
Dabo Swinney - Clemson - $8.32M
Justin Fuente - VT - $4.25M
Pat Narduzzi - Pitt - $4.08M
Bronco Mendenhall - Virginia - $3.84M
Mike Norvell - FSU - $3.53M
Mack Brown - UNC - $3.46M
Dino Babers - Syracuse - $3.21M **private
Dave Doeren - NC State - $3.13M
Geoff Collins - GT - $3.10M
Manny Diaz - Miami - $3.10M **private
Scott Satterfield - Louisville - $3.09M
Jeff Hafley - BC - $3.00M **private
David Cutcliffe - Duke - $2.78M **private
Dave Clawson - Wake Forest - $1.86M **private


Offensive Coordinator:
Tony Elliott - Clemson - $1.52M
Phil Longo - UNC - $825k
Dwayne Ledford - Louisville - $750k
Tim Beck - NC State - $639k
Kenny Dillingham - FSU - $616k
Robert Anae - Virginia - $608k
Brad Cornelsen - VT - $490k
Dave Patenaude - GT - $400k

Defensive Coordinator:
Brent Venables - Clemson - $2.16M
Jay Bateman - UNC - $825k
Adam Fuller - FSU - $788k
Bryan Brown - Louisville - $750k
Tony Gibson - NC State - $662k
Nick Howell - Virginia - $608k
Justin Hamilton - VT - $600k
Andrew Thacker - GT - $450k

Remaining Assistants Combined:
Clemson - $3.96M
FSU - $3.95M
UNC - $3.22M
Louisville - $3.06M
NC State - $2.66M
VT - $2.50M
GT - $2.39M
Virginia - $2.36M

Assistant Coaching Staff Total:
Clemson - $7.64M
FSU - $5.36M
UNC - $4.87M
Louisville - $4.56M
NC State - $3.96M
VT - $3.60M
Virginia - $3.57M
GT - $3.24M

Coaching Staff Total:
Clemson - $15.96M
FSU - $8.89M
UNC - $8.33M
VT - $7.85M
Louisville $7.65M
Virginia - $7.41M
NC State - $7.09M
GT - $6.34M
I say we’re not getting our moneys worth. So are several other teams.
 

whiskey clear

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Collins get $3 million a year. MAC coaches are gonna be around $1 million a year. Heck, Key is probably making about as much as some MAC head coaches.

We are spending like an ACC school...
No. Tech is spending better than the bottom of the ACC. The ACC. Want to play like uga and Clemson. Pay like they do, from top to bottom. You still can’t “pay” players to come to your school. But you can damn sure pay coaches to come coach. There isn’t enough “want to.”
 

whiskey clear

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ok, so we are paying the HC like ACC, but not the rest of the staff.

how does it compare to the MAC salaries?
Pardon my exaggeration but my point stands. GT isn’t willing to pony up to compete. Even after making an improvement over the last couple of staffs. They have a losers mindset and it’s paying dividends.
 

QuadF

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Tenn plays 8 games every year in the SEC.

That rolling average would be great in the Big12, but in the SEC there are 6 schools that Recruit better than them each year.

Every yr they play:

UGA
UF
Bama
Auburn (?)
Not sure who they play from the crossover games, but when Half of your Conference out recruits you, you are looking at 4-5 loss seasons before injury & attrition is taken under consideration

Gotta tell both sides of the story.
I see you ignored the dumpster fire that is fsu ;) There are other examples in there too.
 

PressManCoverage

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Of course, better players make any coach look better. And yes, in college football recuriting might be 70% of the game now. That remaining 30% matters. If the coaching was substantially equal, then why was Alabama not like they are now for the 90's and most of the 00's?

I also get that overwhelming talent advantage will overcome poor/average coaching quite a bit, in part due to the incredible disparity between college programs.

I understand that "running up the gut" is necessary in order to keep the D honest as well as to hopefully setup something later in the game. I haven't seen any such designs from Pnope. Inside the redzone when the field is compressed, doing something different or at least getting the talent in space would likely yield better results. Going to be hard to win more games this season when the team consistently stalls out in the redzone unless an opponent is unprepared like UNC was when Sims came in. The gamefilm is out on Sims now. Time for Pnope to adjust.

I guess that where we diverge here is that I do not think that GT will be on equal footing with the better teams on its schedule (Clemson/Ugag) on a consistent basis from a talent perspective. If were are to compete with them and presumably, get some wins, wouldn't a coaching advantage help narrow the talent gap? If the coaching is substantially equal--not just in teaching schemes/practice--then how do you think GT will win like we want as fans?

Hey, I hope that I'm wrong and Collins starts to consistently pull in top 15 recruiting classes here and GT just out talents most of its competition. In the meantime, I am hoping for a big OC upgrade for next season.
Sir, I want all areas of GT FB to improve, including coaching.

However at this time, the only coaching that is way below Par is OLine ,Secondary, Special Teams.

PNode isn't responsible for any of those areas, yet after Games everyone rips him and says, " well if we would call better plays things would go differently".

I want better coaching too, but the blanket drive by attacks for playcalls, QB, and "the HC is a used car salesman "doesn't fairly describe what is going on with GT FB.

Sometimes after a loss this Message Board is like a Corporate Meeting where the CEO has gathered his Dept Heads, and the CEO wants to know what is going on, and everyone says the same thing, "we aren't selling enough widgets". (this is the frustrating part about some of our Fans)
 

whiskey clear

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Sir, I want all areas of GT FB to improve, including coaching.

However at this time, the only coaching that is way below Par is OLine ,Secondary, Special Teams.

PNode isn't responsible for any of those areas, yet after Games everyone rips him and says, " well if we would call better plays things would go differently".

I want better coaching too, but the blanket drive by attacks for playcalls, QB, and "the HC is a used car salesman "doesn't fairly describe what is going on with GT FB.

Sometimes after a loss this Message Board is like a Corporate Meeting where the CEO has gathered his Dept Heads, and the CEO wants to know what is going on, and everyone says the same thing, "we aren't selling enough widgets". (this is the frustrating part about some of our Fans)
Negatives are overly focused on after a loss and positives are overly focused on after a win. At year end the truth has been revealed. Here’s to hoping for a 2014 type turnaround.
 

PressManCoverage

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No. Tech is spending better than the bottom of the ACC. The ACC. Want to play like uga and Clemson. Pay like they do, from top to bottom. You still can’t “pay” players to come to your school. But you can damn sure pay coaches to come coach. There isn’t enough “want to.”
Players have been getting paid under the Table since the Ivy League Dominated CFB.

One look at the Player's Parking Lot at places like Bama, UGA, OU, Clemson and you'd understand, those Power Programs get the best players that Money can Buy.

Think of Saban running a program like the Movie Blue Chips except he's doing it at a deep South FB School.

We don't need better coaches, we need more Happy Kuykendahls
 

GT98

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However at this time, the only coaching that is way below Par is OLine ,Secondary, Special Teams.

PNode isn't responsible for any of those areas, yet after Games everyone rips him and says, " well if we would call better plays things would go differently".
I agree on the problem areas. I would argue that the o-line still falls under his purview—at the least he doesn’t seem to do enough to maximize what we do have on offense (playmakers at RB).

Too often, the team looks very disjointed in the redzone. Calling timeout and procedural penalties occur too often in the redzone.

A much better o-line will help any play calls of course.

I stand behind my opinion that since GT is pursuing the Dabo model, big upgrades are needed at the coordinator spots, particular the O. By year 3, he should be better at game planning for what the team can do well.
 

whiskey clear

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Players have been getting paid under the Table since the Ivy League Dominated CFB.

One look at the Player's Parking Lot at places like Bama, UGA, OU, Clemson and you'd understand, those Power Programs get the best players that Money can Buy.

Think of Saban running a program like the Movie Blue Chips except he's doing it at a deep South FB School.

We don't need better coaches, we need more Happy Kuykendahls
Yes cheating has been going on since the beginning. But there is no such thing as getting caught paying coaches a boat load of money to get quality coaching. Tech sucks at cheating (NCAA lives to use Tech type teams to show they enforce rules while looking the other way at big program cheats). Tech needs to pony up where it matters and where they won’t get busted cheating.
 

Liberty

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Yes cheating has been going on since the beginning. But there is no such thing as getting caught paying coaches a boat load of money to get quality coaching. Tech sucks at cheating (NCAA lives to use Tech type teams to show they enforce rules while looking the other way at big program cheats). Tech needs to pony up where it matters and where they won’t get busted cheating.
Our fanbase is delusional. We got some on here thinking we got coaching at the same level as Bammer. They need to pass the pipe, because they’re smoking some good öööö.
 

PressManCoverage

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I agree on the problem areas. I would argue that the o-line still falls under his purview—at the least he doesn’t seem to do enough to maximize what we do have on offense (playmakers at RB).

Too often, the team looks very disjointed in the redzone. Calling timeout and procedural penalties occur too often in the redzone.

A much better o-line will help any play calls of course.

I stand behind my opinion that since GT is pursuing the Dabo model, big upgrades are needed at the coordinator spots, particular the O. By year 3, he should be better at game planning for what the team can do well.
I have a guess, and I have no evidence to prove this guess is correct, but here goes:

I think the issues in the RZ, might be where PNode sends a play in and then after sending the Play in , the guys in huddle send back a signal (or a confused look) that they aren't confident in the Play or they don't know the Blocking Scheme to execute the Play and then they get rushed and hurry in a 2nd play or burn a time-out.

This falls under mental sharpness, mental readiness, mental aptitude for CFB Played at this level, we seem have too many of those Guys on our OLine despite the extra 100-150 points that our Guys have on the SAT vs the typical CFB Player.

So , I don't think PNode is the one that's confused, I think the OL is the one that's confused in the RZ
 
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