i see things havent changed that much

EffinDane said:
It's really not. It's digusting, abhorrent, etc., but what is the fallout from the video? A football player flips? A frat closes one of it's own chapters? So what?

If these kids surrounded another black student and started singing this cheer, then you are in the realm of "serious." Right now, its just "stupid".
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If that's the basis of their argument in court, it's gonna be really hard for them to prove that this wasn't serious.
 
WracerX said:
Singing in a private setting does not constitute causing an uproar. Had they done it on a public setting, then you might have some ground to stand on
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The repercussions of their actions affect the school as well.
 
Akinji07 said:
If that's the basis of their argument in court, it's gonna be really hard for them to prove that this wasn't serious.
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They don't have to prove anything, that burden would be on the state. The state would have to show that it was serious which would be next to impossible in this case.

Now, if the expelled students wanted to sue, they just have to show that the school over reacted, which would be easy based on the school's treatment of actual, physical violence.
 
Akinji07 said:
The repercussions of their actions affect the school as well.
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The school isn't protected from being embarrassed. The school should probably let this drop before some SAE stooge tapes the conversations in the OU locker room. That would break the meter on sexist, racist language.
 
WracerX said:
They don't have to prove anything, that burden would be on the state. The state would have to show that it was serious which would be next to impossible in this case.

Now, if the expelled students wanted to sue, they just have to show that the school over reacted, which would be easy based on the school's treatment of actual, physical violence.
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I agree and we were discussing this today at work. Whether or not they sue depends on the size of their balls and whether they have lots of family money or not.
 
Akinji07 said:
The repercussions of their actions affect the school as well.
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What actions did they take? Is there more than I heard? Did they bomb any churches in Mississippi? Did they beat up marchers on the bridge in Selma?
 
Akinji07 said:
Let's look at it from another point of view. Obviously the freedom of speech is the argument for the SAE students who got expelled. what about the school? Can they not claim that SAE actions caused possible material damages to the school due to implications on its reputation? I know it's not the same as a private business but if I had an employee who was caught on camera doing exactly what the SAE students were doing, I could claim that my employee's actions were damaging to the reputation of the firm and has a very negative impact on the clientele. Isn't there a provision in law that applies to public institutions as well? After all, OU may be a public institution but they rely on student tuitions as well and a negative impact on the reputation of the school could impact it.

If not then what sort of actions can a public university take to stop their school becoming rampant with bigoted speech? We all seem to agree that they had a right to disallow SAE from using their frat house. But what about student organizations that don't rely on any kind of school funds or property? If the school simply cannot expel students from making the college seem like a safe haven for racists, what could it do?
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ACLU has already tried this case before the supreme court. Oklahoma is screwed.

What probably already has happened is they have reached out to the students explaining the expulsion is under review.
 
GTCrew said:
ACLU has already tried this case before the supreme court. Oklahoma is screwed.

What probably already has happened is they have reached out to the students explaining the expulsion is under review.
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Can the ACLU sue if the students don't want them to?
 
beej67 said:
Do what?

If I post a dick shot to Facebook, am I arrested for indecent exposure?.
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no, but Facebook removes the post. you dont have the right to sue them for preventing your free speech because you violated their terms of use

they might even block your account, and prevent you from posting further

just like these kids violated their terms of student-ness that they agreed to when enrolling under the code of conduct
 
andrew said:
Can the ACLU sue if the students don't want them to?
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Not the point, the point is there is no arguing about the result. Its already had the ultimate decider weigh in. Oklahoma has to manage this at this point, they can't win, but they can minimize their losses.
 
BuzzCzar said:
no, but Facebook removes the post. you dont have the right to sue them for preventing your free speech because you violated their terms of use

they might even block your account, and prevent you from posting further

just like these kids violated their terms of student-ness that they agreed to when enrolling under the code of conduct
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Facebook = private, University of Oklahoma = government

Speech codes at public schools almost universally lose legal challenges. See Sklar vs Clough or any FIRE/ACLU campus initiative

HOWEVER, I read one of the kid's apologies and he stated that he willingly withdrew which is different than what's been reported
 
EffinDane said:
Facebook = private, University of Oklahoma = government
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i realize the difference, i was just directly responding to Beejs stated scenario

if they had filed a petition to hold a protest and then been given a permit and sand that song to their hearts' content then i agree with you

however, i think this incident is more grey than that (didnt want to say black and white)
 
This is why we need to get the government out of education, amirite? We should be able to get rid of assholes. ;)
 
BuzzCzar said:
these kids violated their terms of student-ness
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I call Shenanigans.

Where's my broom?

You don't need a permit to exercise free speech in your own home. Where was this video shot again?
 
ramblinwise1 said:
What actions did they take? Is there more than I heard? Did they bomb any churches in Mississippi? Did they beat up marchers on the bridge in Selma?
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no but i'm sure you'd defend them if they did that too.

i don't need to explain öööö to you, since you won't get it.

pick someone else to play with.
 
I don't believe any study which claims to show that one race is smarter or taller or faster or whatever than another. And stop trying to convince me otherwise.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
declinometer said:
'What do we want, dead cops, when do we want them now'
Being these chants came in the wake of Ferguson, I don't think that these protestors were chanting about black cops.
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So...you're saying the Ferguson protesters should be expelled from OU as well?
 
BuzzCzar said:
i might have kicked them out for their own protection, as defending them from the potential harm that will befall them would be too much for the University to contain, and the potential liability of them getting beat up and maybe killed too great a risk for the University to bear
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So who, pray tell, will be perpetrating this beat down and murder?
 
My guess is that no one will know who these guys are in a month. They weren't in any danger.
 
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