State of College Football….

[justafan]

Is there any fan out there who thinks college football is better now? Excluding UGA fans because they're idiots and their opinions don't matter.

 

[justafan]

Is there any fan out there who thinks college football is better now? Excluding UGA fans because they're idiots and their opinions don't matter.

*Just a fan, not a former player or someone with a financial interest

 

[USCJacket]

you’re making my point…and even if there is a semblance of truth to what you say regarding GT buying 5 stars, is that scenario something you want to be a part of? It’s fine if you do, but don’t be surprised when cfb starts hemorrhaging it’s long term fan base, including me.

I do agree GT is cheap and our admin has historically been dismissive towards our athletic program…but that’s a different discussion.

The thing is, you‘re more than likely not the age of fan this is all being geared towards. Fox, ESPN, NBC / CBS are all making these expansion decisions behind the scenes to get the 25 & younger demographic back engaged with CFB. This is the first time since most of us have been alive that the reality is CFB is seeing a decline in interest by the next generation of fans. So the goal of the networks is now to re-engage the audience by creating made for TV games from noon until midnight on Saturday, in addition to Tuesday through Friday night games. That’s coming with all this. Will it ever be Alabama vs LSU on a Tuesday through Friday? No. But it will be something like South Carolina vs Mizzou or Michigan vs Purdue, Oklahoma State vs Arizona, etc.

Networks know the core base 35+ is there, despite all the “take my ball and go home” stances over the last few days will eventually settle down. Everyone is emotionally charged right now.

Will I continue to watch as a 42 yo who has loved CFB since I can remember watching as a kid in the 80’s? Yes. But let’s be real here, as we’ve all grown older the emotional impact of a win or loss isn’t what it was as a teen through your 20’s. In the end it’s just a game.

Time will tell whether the “all in” $$ being pumped into expansion by TV networks will work. I have a feeling in 5 years most people will look back and not really have a problem with how the conferences as a whole look. The other factors like player contracts I think will eventually be the sticking point to a lot of traditional CFB fans. To me personally, that will have the biggest impact on the future of the 40+ yo fan base across the board.

 

[andrew]

You guys are leaving out the obvious - NOW every team can buy players. Back then players were bought under the table without punishment from the NCAA because it was a corrupt system and the Auburns and UGA’s knew they were protected while GT couldn’t buy players without getting hammered because we weren’t protected. Today everyone is on the same level playing field. Just because some schools choose to not buy players doesn’t mean others can’t. I’ll take fairness any day than watching us lose to teams who were being protected by the NCAA.

I'm not leaving that out. I (and most people, I think) fully acknowledge it.

Yes previously the top schools would cheat and buy players, but most of the rest would not (at least not egregiously), and even the top teams that were cheating had to be at least a little careful and couldn't buy entire classes. You could still catch lightning in a bottle and win a lot of big games doing it the right way. Hell, you could even get a player like Calvin Johnson to go to a school like Georgia Tech.

Now there's no cheating and everyone is free to spend money on as many payers as they want. But that means winning is even more about the money than it was before (no one's turning down $1 million from U[sic]GA to go to Tech), and along with that has come the destruction of regional conferences and traditional rivalries.

I prefer the way it used to be. Sure it was corrupt but it was at least closer to what I want college football to be.

 

[OptionJacket]

Sure, but that was called cheating. It’s now legal. That’s a quantum leap. Programs used to be penalized for it, now they’re applauded. To each his own, and I personally don’t like the “progress” we’ve made.

We just disagree that teams were punished. Yes, ALL the factories bought players in some form or fashion whether it was cars, cash, mortgages paid off, hookers, etc. But show me where ANY of them were punished? I can think of 1. USC with the Reggie Bush stuff. Please show me where UGA, Bama, Auburn, Clemson, FSU, Michigan, Notre Dame, or Ohio State were EVER punished? They weren’t because they were protected by the people who do the investigations. Meanwhile, the little guys like SMU and GT were massively punished.

This is my entire point - the system has been rigged for decades to benefit the factories by protecting them and punishing anyone who dares to join the club. NIL and an expanded playoff now opens the door for every school without worry of the NCAA hammering them for doing the same thing the factories do. I would think GT fans would appreciate not having a future title stripped because they had the audacity to be good.

 

[andrew]

We just disagree that teams were punished. Yes, ALL the factories bought players in some form or fashion whether it was cars, cash, mortgages paid off, hookers, etc. But show me where ANY of them were punished? I can think of 1. USC with the Reggie Bush stuff. Please show me where UGA, Bama, Auburn, Clemson, FSU, Michigan, Notre Dame, or Ohio State were EVER punished? They weren’t because they were protected by the people who do the investigations. Meanwhile, the little guys like SMU and GT were massively punished.

This is my entire point - the system has been rigged for decades to benefit the factories by protecting them and punishing anyone who dares to join the club. NIL and an expanded playoff now opens the door for every school without worry of the NCAA hammering them for doing the same thing the factories do. I would think GT fans would appreciate not having a future title stripped because they had the audacity to be good.

You really can't think of even one instance where one of those teams was punished? Do you not remember the big Ohio State tattoo scandal that resulted in a bowl ban? Or the FSU one where it was revealed like half the team couldn't read, and they lost scholarships?

I won't argue that the system wasn't rigged before. It was. And I certainly won't argue that top schools were punished as much or as often as they should have been. But there were still rules in place, and schools were at least somewhat careful to not violate them too often or too much. The balance between buying players and traditional recruiting was just that -- a balance. And for the non-factory schools, that balance was much more towards traditional recruiting.

In the new world, there is not much balance. It is all about buying players for almost all teams. Even the top teams who used to buy players before are doing it to a much greater extent now, and a lot of schools who wouldn't even think about buying players before are asking fans to open their wallets and donate to the NIL collective.

You say that this makes it so that all schools can do what the factories used to do without worry of the NCAA hammering, and that you would think GT fans would appreciate that. But most GT fans don't want to do what the factories do.

Before, not doing what the factories do was at least an option you could take with some level of success. Now, it's not -- it's do what the factories do, or...well, there is no other option. Everyone is doing it.

 

[OptionJacket]

Yes previously the top schools would cheat and buy players, but most of the rest would not (at least not egregiously), and even the top teams that were cheating had to be at least a little careful and couldn't buy entire classes. You could still catch lightning in a bottle and win a lot of big games doing it the right way. Hell, you could even get a player like Calvin Johnson to go to a school like Georgia Tech.

I disagree with the premise that “the rest would not”. VT bought Vick. Look at what that 1 player did for that program over a 20 year period. I’m down here in south Georgia with a lot of friends in the high school circuit from Lee County to Colquitt to Thomasville to Valdosta. And let me simply say a lot of players are being “induced“ by schools at all levels. Everyone is looking to “buy” players at their own level. We only talk about the P5 big boys but you don’t think teams like Valdosta State, Georgia Southern, FAMU aren’t engaged in luring players from their competitors? It’s common knowledge amongst the high school coaches. Heck, down here and in the high schools in Atlanta, coaches are inducing high school players to “relocate”. How do you think Probst won in Moultrie? Heck, I know at least 10 kids who live in Albany but play for Lee County by using relative addresses or the boosters getting mama a nice condo on the other side of the county line.

Point is if you think only a few teams were buying players then that’s just pretending in the tooth fairy. At least now it’s legal and any team can do it without the NCAA using their selective enforcement. Seriously, we got stripped of a championship banner because of clothes while UGA players were getting cars. So see, we were cheating, just ask the NCAA.

 

[G776T]

We just disagree that teams were punished. Yes, ALL the factories bought players in some form or fashion whether it was cars, cash, mortgages paid off, hookers, etc. But show me where ANY of them were punished? I can think of 1. USC with the Reggie Bush stuff. Please show me where UGA, Bama, Auburn, Clemson, FSU, Michigan, Notre Dame, or Ohio State were EVER punished? They weren’t because they were protected by the people who do the investigations. Meanwhile, the little guys like SMU and GT were massively punished.

This is my entire point - the system has been rigged for decades to benefit the factories by protecting them and punishing anyone who dares to join the club. NIL and an expanded playoff now opens the door for every school without worry of the NCAA hammering them for doing the same thing the factories do. I would think GT fans would appreciate not having a future title stripped because they had the audacity to be good.

Auburn and bama both got small punishments, might have cost auburn an mnc in 1993. But yeah, tech has probably gotten more in penalties than all of the factories combined

 

[andrew]

I disagree with the premise that “the rest would not”. VT bought Vick. Look at what that 1 player did for that program over a 20 year period. I’m down here in south Georgia with a lot of friends in the high school circuit from Lee County to Colquitt to Thomasville to Valdosta. And let me simply say a lot of players are being “induced“ by schools at all levels. Everyone is looking to “buy” players at their own level. We only talk about the P5 big boys but you don’t think teams like Valdosta State, Georgia Southern, FAMU aren’t engaged in luring players from their competitors? It’s common knowledge amongst the high school coaches. Heck, down here and in the high schools in Atlanta, coaches are inducing high school players to “relocate”. How do you think Probst won in Moultrie? Heck, I know at least 10 kids who live in Albany but play for Lee County by using relative addresses or the boosters getting mama a nice condo on the other side of the county line.

Point is if you think only a few teams were buying players then that’s just pretending in the tooth fairy. At least now it’s legal and any team can do it without the NCAA using their selective enforcement. Seriously, we got stripped of a championship banner because of clothes while UGA players were getting cars. So see, we were cheating, just ask the NCAA.

It's a matter of degree. Yes, we were cheating. We bought Demaryius Thomas $300 worth of clothes, and a crazy woman took our players to the aquarium. But when you look at the most important factor in whether we got a player or not, it was not that money. It was the school, the coaching staff, the city, etc. And that was true of most non-factory programs, albeit to varying degrees.

In the new world, paying players is, or is going to be, the most important factor in most recruiting battles.

 

[OptionJacket]

You really can't think of even one instance where one of those teams was punished? Do you not remember the big Ohio State tattoo scandal that resulted in a bowl ban? Or the FSU one where it was revealed like half the team couldn't read, and they lost scholarships?

I won't argue that the system wasn't rigged before. It was. And I certainly won't argue that top schools were punished as much or as often as they should have been. But there were still rules in place, and schools were at least somewhat careful to not violate them too often or too much. The balance between buying players and traditional recruiting was just that -- a balance. And for the non-factory schools, that balance was much more towards traditional recruiting.

In the new world, there is not much balance. It is all about buying players for almost all teams. Even the top teams who used to buy players before are doing it to a much greater extent now, and a lot of schools who wouldn't even think about buying players before are asking fans to open their wallets and donate to the NIL collective.

You say that this makes it so that all schools can do what the factories used to do without worry of the NCAA hammering, and that you would think GT fans would appreciate that. But most GT fans don't want to do what the factories do.

Before, not doing what the factories do was at least an option you could take with some level of success. Now, it's not -- it's do what the factories do, or...well, there is no other option. Everyone is doing it.

I think we agree on most points overall. I don’t disagree with this. My hatred for the bowl system and the NCAA was born while I was a student at GT and saw how they did everything except force Tom Osborne to vote for Colorado to screw us. I still remember being on campus at my fraternity house when they announced we won the coaches poll. While everyone was cheering I sat there and realized we were 1 switched vote from being the only undefeated team in the country and losing both polls all because McCartney spent weeks lobbying the west coast and Midwest media for his team while our coach didn’t because we were having to move up the rankings while Colorado was already there.

I think this idea of balance in past years is just a myth. And GT fans aren’t a good gauge because we are spoiled compared to most. We’ve had 3 high level coaches Ross, O’Leary, and Johnson who elevated our 3 stars. We’ve been incredibly lucky to have tasted success over the past 30 year. However, we may now realize what most fanbases have been dealing with decade after decade of nothingness. Think of the past 40 years for UNC, NCState, Duke, South Carolina, Vandy, Arkansas, Okie State, UVA, Maryland, Pitt Kentucky, etc. None of them have tasted anything near our success over the past 40 years and just spend season after season being a numb .500 program with a few outliers. I pray Key is the next guy who can elevate our team because right now we are at a crossroads. It’s been 8 straight seasons of worthless football on the Flats which is reflected by our game day crowd.

 

[GoldZ]

It's a matter of degree. Yes, we were cheating. We bought Demaryius Thomas $300 worth of clothes, and a crazy woman took our players to the aquarium. But when you look at the most important factor in whether we got a player or not, it was not that money. It was the school, the coaching staff, the city, etc. And that was true of most non-factory programs, albeit to varying degrees.

In the new world, paying players is, or is going to be, the most important factor in most recruiting battles.

Look guys, this post by andrew kinda wraps it up. Just because the current mess is new, modern, me too, youth oriented, or politically correct....does NOT mean it's better than the imperfect past. I for one think the word "college" should be removed from post high school football. Btw, we are well on the way to ruining even hs football. It really is a matter of degree. Three or four draft Stellas is a good thing---nine or ten... not so much. Word on campus for years was a good thing--- the Jan Kemp issue at uga or the more recent unc online debacle...not so much.

 

[1990wspjacket]

The only current way i can think of to fix this and make it even for all colleges is to make a salary cap for NIL, even then the $$$ would be still given to recruits behind the scenes for the factory schools. And then we are back to square one.

 

[donsue]

It's also a numbers game. How much would each of us here have to give to equal all the Bama sidewalk fans giving $100?

There are Tech alums that could make Bama fans look silly in the bank account department. Buying kids isn’t about filling a tip jar with $20 bills by rednecks. It is corporate/private collectives. Again, there has to be a desire and a commitment.

 

[GoldenIsle]

I think we agree on most points overall. I don’t disagree with this. My hatred for the bowl system and the NCAA was born while I was a student at GT and saw how they did everything except force Tom Osborne to vote for Colorado to screw us. I still remember being on campus at my fraternity house when they announced we won the coaches poll. While everyone was cheering I sat there and realized we were 1 switched vote from being the only undefeated team in the country and losing both polls all because McCartney spent weeks lobbying the west coast and Midwest media for his team while our coach didn’t because we were having to move up the rankings while Colorado was already there.

I think this idea of balance in past years is just a myth. And GT fans aren’t a good gauge because we are spoiled compared to most. We’ve had 3 high level coaches Ross, O’Leary, and Johnson who elevated our 3 stars. We’ve been incredibly lucky to have tasted success over the past 30 year. However, we may now realize what most fanbases have been dealing with decade after decade of nothingness. Think of the past 40 years for UNC, NCState, Duke, South Carolina, Vandy, Arkansas, Okie State, UVA, Maryland, Pitt Kentucky, etc. None of them have tasted anything near our success over the past 40 years and just spend season after season being a numb .500 program with a few outliers. I pray Key is the next guy who can elevate our team because right now we are at a crossroads. It’s been 8 straight seasons of worthless football on the Flats which is reflected by our game day crowd.

2016 was pretty good … best UGA and won the Gator Bowl.

 

[CornerBlitz]

The thing is, you‘re more than likely not the age of fan this is all being geared towards. Fox, ESPN, NBC / CBS are all making these expansion decisions behind the scenes to get the 25 & younger demographic back engaged with CFB. This is the first time since most of us have been alive that the reality is CFB is seeing a decline in interest by the next generation of fans. So the goal of the networks is now to re-engage the audience by creating made for TV games from noon until midnight on Saturday, in addition to Tuesday through Friday night games. That’s coming with all this. Will it ever be Alabama vs LSU on a Tuesday through Friday? No. But it will be something like South Carolina vs Mizzou or Michigan vs Purdue, Oklahoma State vs Arizona, etc.

Networks know the core base 35+ is there, despite all the “take my ball and go home” stances over the last few days will eventually settle down. Everyone is emotionally charged right now.

Will I continue to watch as a 42 yo who has loved CFB since I can remember watching as a kid in the 80’s? Yes. But let’s be real here, as we’ve all grown older the emotional impact of a win or loss isn’t what it was as a teen through your 20’s. In the end it’s just a game.

Time will tell whether the “all in” $$ being pumped into expansion by TV networks will work. I have a feeling in 5 years most people will look back and not really have a problem with how the conferences as a whole look. The other factors like player contracts I think will eventually be the sticking point to a lot of traditional CFB fans. To me personally, that will have the biggest impact on the future of the 40+ yo fan base across the board.

maybe so. I am no expert on long term media strategies, but it seems like a huge gamble to alienate your core base and replace with a disinterested younger one. Most of the millennials I know prefer the NFL and playing fantasy football. Perhaps that will change…time will tell.

 

[OptionJacket]

2016 was pretty good … best UGA and won the Gator Bowl.

True that. My mistake. I remember walking out of the stadium in Jacksonville telling my son we are set with Mills at BBack. Its been all down hill since.

 

[GTLiebs]

There are Tech alums that could make Bama fans look silly in the bank account department. Buying kids isn’t about filling a tip jar with $20 bills by rednecks. It is corporate/private collectives. Again, there has to be a desire and a commitment.

Yes, but it's likely harder to convince one person to put down $1 million for a player than it is to convince a couple thousand fans to put down a couple hundreds.

 

[Supersize that order mutt]

We just disagree that teams were punished. Yes, ALL the factories bought players in some form or fashion whether it was cars, cash, mortgages paid off, hookers, etc. But show me where ANY of them were punished? I can think of 1. USC with the Reggie Bush stuff. Please show me where UGA, Bama, Auburn, Clemson, FSU, Michigan, Notre Dame, or Ohio State were EVER punished? They weren’t because they were protected by the people who do the investigations. Meanwhile, the little guys like SMU and GT were massively punished.

This is my entire point - the system has been rigged for decades to benefit the factories by protecting them and punishing anyone who dares to join the club. NIL and an expanded playoff now opens the door for every school without worry of the NCAA hammering them for doing the same thing the factories do. I would think GT fans would appreciate not having a future title stripped because they had the audacity to be good.

Even after the Jan Kemp revelations about what was going on in the cesspool, they only got a slap on the wrist.

 

[originalwombat]

Certainly conference re-alignment - at least this latest version of it - could not come at a worse time for Tech. Our two primary sports are down and haven’t been adding much in the way of revenue for quite some time. Our leverage is at an all time low, and thus, so are our suitors.

The only two conferences that offer attractive opponents (ie games I would pay to see) are the Big 10 and SEC, and both are (presumably) near max capacity and courting other teams to round things out.

At best we are on the edge of obscurity and at worst possible extinction.

I’m going to brutally honest and say that I will likely lose all interest in Tech football if we end up in ANY of the other conferences. I’m not interested in playing and developing a rivalry with someone like E Carolina or Memphis. öööö those guys. If that’s who we are playing on Saturdays, them I’m going all in on my kids’ schools (Tenn and Clem), and Tech just becomes a “remember the good ‘ol days” folk tale.

 

[00Burdell]

Certainly conference re-alignment - at least this latest version of it - could not come at a worse time for Tech. Our two primary sports are down and haven’t been adding much in the way of revenue for quite some time. Our leverage is at an all time low, and thus, so are our suitors.

The only two conferences that offer attractive opponents (ie games I would pay to see) are the Big 10 and SEC, and both are (presumably) near max capacity and courting other teams to round things out.

At best we are on the edge of obscurity and at worst possible extinction.

I’m going to brutally honest and say that I will likely lose all interest in Tech football if we end up in ANY of the other conferences. I’m not interested in playing and developing a rivalry with someone like E Carolina or Memphis. öööö those guys. If that’s who we are playing on Saturdays, them I’m going all in on my kids’ schools (Tenn and Clem), and Tech just becomes a “remember the good ‘ol days” folk tale.

Why would you drop out based on what conference we are in? I don’t understand that at all. Your decision, of course.

We did win all the marbles barely 10 years after joining the ACC. Just pointing it out.