Thoughts?

First off, your sarcasm is not needed. Just because I've challenged your opinion doesn't mean that you need to act like the rest of us are stupid. I look at the GT football program much like I look at my own life and my career. If I think that I cannot achieve, I won't. Its really that simple. So if I'm going to bother donating money, buying season tickets, and supporting this program, I want to make sure that I am doing so with the understanding that we are striving to be the best. Otherwise, why the hell do it? Why give money to something that only strives to be half ass? or 3/4's ass? GT certainly didn't teach me that.

I remember the motto my freshman year in 1991, "Georgia Tech: We don't fit the mold, we make it!" Does that only apply to the classroom?

But I'm not going to give an answer to a predetermined and more than likely WRONG set of choices. You believe that we have a very little chance of improving and a very large chance of hurting the program. If I believed, like you do, that we only have a 10% chance of improving, then I would agree that we need to stay put.

But I think we have a great chance of improving the program. Maybe not in the first year, but in the next 3 easily. Coaching changes happen EVERY year. there is no good year to fire a coach in that regard. However, I think that the entire football program is at a MAJOR crossroads.

We either need to decide right now and be united in that decision that we are either a.) Lucky to maintain 7-5 seasons or b.) We want to strive to be the best.

I want something greater and I think we have very good leadership in the GTAA with DRad and I think we have a very unique product that will draw the recruits and fans.

If we think this is the best we can be, then everyone needs to take a big bite of humble pie and say, "OK, THIS IS WHAT WE ARE!" And lets all accept it.

Last I checked, that viewpoint was decidedly unpopular when Braine said it. So I have to imagine that most people think that we can be great, its just going to take some time to get there, and for me personally, Gailey is getting in the way.
 
ncjacket said:
But if you support him because you think he's the best we can do AND WE CAN'T BE BETTER THAN WE ARE then I have a real problem with your approach. You aren't supporting him because you think he's good, you're supporting him because you don't think we can be better.
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Nail meet Hammer. Thank you for summarizing that so succinctly.
 
ncjacket said:
If you're telling me you believe Chan will get us to that level where we're IN the top 25 consistently, beat ugag on a regular basis and make us relevant in the ACC annually and nationally occassionally, then fine. Support him. But if you support him because you think he's the best we can do AND WE CAN'T BE BETTER THAN WE ARE then I have a real problem with your approach. You aren't supporting him because you think he's good, you're supporting him because you don't think we can be better.
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Well, actually, I do support him because I think he'll get us to a higher level. He's not perfect, but he's got a lot of good qualities for a place like GT. He's improved the program steadily since he got here, is recruiting better, is retaining players better, is (slowly) making positive changes to the staff. We're a better program now than we were when he came.

Beating UGA regularly is, unfortunately, a taller task now than it has been since Dooley was coaching in the early 80's. We'll win a few of those, but beating the pups regularly is a tall task for Florida right now.

But other than that, yes, I think Gailey is doing the right things, and doing them the right way.

Put it this way. I think Gailey has as least as much chance of taking us to the "next" level as any hypothetical new hire we bring in to replace him. And a much, much lower chance of returning Tech to suckdom. If we want to build the program, our best bet is to hold onto Gailey and give him the support he needs.
 
I personally believe if we had the right QB (may be nesbitt) then we could go to the next level under Gailey.

I am ok w/ a change I think the AD understand that he would lose his job if the program took a step backwards.

I also think there is a strong possibility that there will not be a change.

I hope we beat Ugag then all this becomes moot, unless CG leaves on his own.
 
elwoodGT said:
Well, actually, I do support him because I think he'll get us to a higher level. He's not perfect, but he's got a lot of good qualities for a place like GT. He's improved the program steadily since he got here, is recruiting better, is retaining players better, is (slowly) making positive changes to the staff. We're a better program now than we were when he came.

Beating UGA regularly is, unfortunately, a taller task now than it has been since Dooley was coaching in the early 80's. We'll win a few of those, but beating the pups regularly is a tall task for Florida right now.

But other than that, yes, I think Gailey is doing the right things, and doing them the right way.

Put it this way. I think Gailey has as least as much chance of taking us to the "next" level as any hypothetical new hire we bring in to replace him. And a much, much lower chance of returning Tech to suckdom. If we want to build the program, our best bet is to hold onto Gailey and give him the support he needs.
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:+1:

and I believe all the reasons you stated are why CG will be back next year
 
BOR, I don't think you're stupid. I'm sorry you read that in what I said.

I do think you're presenting a false dichotomy. Our choices are not limited to keeping Gailey and accepting that we can do no better than 7-5, or firing him and trying to improve.

Do you manage other employees? When someone is doing an okay job, but has room for improvement, do you see that decision in the same light? As in, we either keep this guy around and accept that we can't do any better, or fire him now?

Of course not! There are a hundred ways to improve without firing your employees! In fact, firing is counterproductive, because then you incur the expense of finding, hiring, and training the new guy. And in the end, he might not be any better.

Now of course, when the employee in question is skipping work and showing up drunk, you fire him and move on. But that's not happening here.
 
elwoodGT said:
Put it this way. I think Gailey has as least as much chance of taking us to the "next" level as any hypothetical new hire we bring in to replace him. And a much, much lower chance of returning Tech to suckdom. If we want to build the program, our best bet is to hold onto Gailey and give him the support he needs.
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Did you not follow us last year? If he couldn't get it done last year, it ain't never gonna happen. The ACC will never be much worse that it was last year and UGA will probably not be as bad as they were last year anytime in the near future. Still no ACC Champ, lost to dogs and finished unranked! And last year was our peak!

I'm not sure what team you're watching or if you've ever played a game of football in your entire life, but the evidence is there, whether or not you choose to accept it is your problem.
 
elwood, okay I can accept that. My problem with a lot of the people now supporting Chan is that they present it as if he's our only hope of maintaining what we have. If you truly think he can lead us to the same place I want to go, I have no problem with that. I happen to disagree, but that's no big deal. Just don't tell me we can't get there.
 
MaconGTfan said:
Did you not follow us last year? If he couldn't get it done last year, it ain't never gonna happen. The ACC will never be much worse that it was last year and UGA will probably not be as bad as they were last year anytime in the near future. Still no ACC Champ, lost to dogs and finished unranked! And last year was our peak!

I'm not sure what team you're watching or if you've ever played a game of football in your entire life, but the evidence is there, whether or not you choose to accept it is your problem.
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You think our peak is with Reggie Ball at QB?

Do you think Reggie is the best QB ever at GT?

that is interesting
 
law_bee said:
You think our peak is with Reggie Ball at QB?

Do you think Reggie is the best QB ever at GT?

that is interesting
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Under the Gailey era, yes, last year was our peak, its been 6 years now man, how many years does someone need?

You'd have to talk to Chan about that one...he started Ball for 4-years while he regressed, meanwhile the best replacement we could come up with has played 1 year of football his entire life and is dead last (or was last week) in the entire nation in Passing TD's.

We had the best WR in the country, the best RB in the ACC and a 4-year starter at QB and we couldn't score a TD against Wake and put up a whopping 10 or so points on UGA, couldn't even get Calvin a reception against Clemson!...whoopee.

Generally speaking, last year was the year to get over the hump and it wasn't done. The team had a complete meltdown those last few games, very Chan-esq.
 
Personally, I think Chan Gailey is perfectly capable of leading Tech to the promised land.

However, keeping him around after a 5th strait loss to Georgia, with his deepest and most experienced squad to date, would mean not only accepting that we're never getting any better, but conceding it publicly in the face of future fans, recruits, etc, who have all grown disenchanted with him, which will damage our program. With a few more wins this year he wouldn't be in that situation, but it is what it is. I'll lay it out as simple and ugly as I can:


If Chan's players had not screwed up so much versus UVA (muffed punt, false start, etc) and Maryland (hold, etc) then Chan's job would be safe. Chan has his players to blame, and I hope they realize it, once he's gone.

That's a terrible thing to say, but it's the truth.
 
law_bee said:
You think our peak is with Reggie Ball at QB?

Do you think Reggie is the best QB ever at GT?

that is interesting
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And round and round we go.

Who placed RB at QB and kept him there for four years? Who couldn't find anyone better in four years? Who couldn't make him significantly better in four years?

He is mentioned as possibly the worst four-year starter QB in NCAA history (don't remember the website). The coach HAS to take blame for that. He kept him the starter and if he had no better alternatives then that's his problem too.
 
At least after Saturday this debate will be over (hopefully) or at worst delayed until next year.
 
elwoodGT said:
BOR, I don't think you're stupid. I'm sorry you read that in what I said.

I do think you're presenting a false dichotomy. Our choices are not limited to keeping Gailey and accepting that we can do no better than 7-5, or firing him and trying to improve.

Do you manage other employees? When someone is doing an okay job, but has room for improvement, do you see that decision in the same light? As in, we either keep this guy around and accept that we can't do any better, or fire him now?

Of course not! There are a hundred ways to improve without firing your employees! In fact, firing is counterproductive, because then you incur the expense of finding, hiring, and training the new guy. And in the end, he might not be any better.

Now of course, when the employee in question is skipping work and showing up drunk, you fire him and move on. But that's not happening here.
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Interesting analogy that I identify with directly.

If I had an employee who was managing a product that I expected to achieve 20% growth and that employee merely maintained status quo then I might not fire him, but I would darn sure reassign that product to someone else. I might give him a year to get oriented. I might even give him three years in extraordinary circumstances. But after five years I would have to assume he had done as well as he ever could.

Chan isn't just an employee. He is managing our most important product. And he isn't meeting his goals. And I would never sit pat with an underperforming product because the replacement "MIGHT not be any better." Maybe we could reassign Chan to a less critical product to see if he improves, like the ultimate frisbee team.
 
FAN OF BOBBY DODD said:
[

I gave Chan 4 years by being stubborn but that's my mistake and I'm man enough to admit it. We have the talent so no excuses there as well.
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I have the greatest respect for you and your football knowledge but it would seem if anyone could understand the handicap that Chan has had (flunkgate/probation) you would. Actually I think he has done quite well under the circumstances. Sure he has made mistakes and will continue to do so but I don't see anyone who could have done better. I believe if we will let him get beyond these issues he will do great. Yes we have had winning seasons every year he has been here and I have seen it much worse.[/quote]
EXCUSES! TIRED OF THAT BS.
 
law_bee said:
I personally believe if we had the right QB (may be nesbitt) then we could go to the next level under Gailey.


I hope we beat Ugag then all this becomes moot, unless CG leaves on his own.
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I would be surprised if anyone believes we have a chance of beating UGA with TB as the QB. Nesbitt has the talent to pull it off. Even if he does fumble the game away, it is better to at least have a chance to win, and just maybe he grows up with the responsibility on his shoulders and the comfort he is not going to be yanked after one bad play. But as last year, Chan will stick with an under performing QB and guarantee us a loss in an important game at the end of the year. Same old, same old.
 
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