CPJ Mad Bro

aeromech said:
There are a lot of people at the NFL level who would question it; but you are entitled to your opinion.
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You are confusing ability and work ethic. Dwyer was on his way to being a first or 2nd round pick and that was actually in spite of playing in the option. Choice just maximized his talent and JD did not.
 
JJacket said:
Dwyer, Johnson, Thomas, Walker....



People think I'm batty when I say we were going to beat UGAg in 2008 anyway, even if we had kept Gailey. I'd say 2009 too.

Flunk gate did not help Gailey one bit.
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I love those guys but maybe 1 of them starts for UGA that year. UGA had Geno Atkins and Justin Houston on the defensive line. Dwyer is probably the 3rd string RB there. Thomas would start but AJ Green is more talented and Massaquoi was also very good.
 
aeromech said:
With the defensive talent Gailey left he would have gotten us back to 7 wins somehow; but he would have gotten crushed at UGA in 2008 again. You don't have to guess, you can look at what Gailey was able to do with a better RB (Choice) and WR (CJ) with a defense as good as 2008's to confidently predict how 2008 would have played out under Gailey.
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Everyone is gonna disagree on the Dwyer piece (I get it) but ignore this part. Isn't scheme a good part of our success in the first two years? As in not many teams had seen the flexbone, and certainly hadn't seen it with P5 athletes? Those first couple years, I remember so many times where defenses were frequently out of position. öööö I remember the camera guys for ESPN getting fooled at the mesh several plays a game, where they would zoom out of frame and Dwyer was breaking for a 20+ yd gain. Obviously camera guys don't equal opposing teams, but it was clear we outschemed a lot of teams early on, and later in the CPJ tenure, we did not.
 
AmpuTECHture said:
Everyone is gonna disagree on the Dwyer piece (I get it) but ignore this part. Isn't scheme a good part of our success in the first two years? As in not many teams had seen the flexbone, and certainly hadn't seen it with P5 athletes? Those first couple years, I remember so many times where defenses were frequently out of position. öööö I remember the camera guys for ESPN getting fooled at the mesh several plays a game, where they would zoom out of frame and Dwyer was breaking for a 20+ yd gain. Obviously camera guys don't equal opposing teams, but it was clear we outschemed a lot of teams early on, and later in the CPJ tenure, we did not.
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This too.
 
Rules changes, social media; and the rise of all the SEC schools around our recruiting turf (plus Clemson) killed us. I would’ve liked to have stayed an option team but I’m different like that. I’m happy with some of the recruiting results and that the narrative around GT is changed a bit but we need results and we need them soon.
 
goldmember said:
Our talent in 2008 was still well behind UGA that year and it was not even close. UGA lost to undefeated Bama, National Champion Florida and us. Very few coaches could of taken that 2008 GT team and beaten UGA and to have done it year 1 transitioning to a drastically different offense was amazing. We had a full back playing one of the A back positions.
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Ant Allen wasn’t a FB. He was a really good tailback at Louisville
 
aeromech said:
Bottom line is I don't think Gailey beats UGA in 2008 with the talent we had in 2008.
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That’s the big question, isn’t it? Peak talent that we can get at GT in the modern era (equivalent to 1990, 1998-2000, 2008-2009) isn’t going to equal the talent Clemson or U[sic]GA are getting now. We aren’t going to outman them, we have to have some other advantage to augment the talent.

First question, can the Collins regime get us back to that level of talent? Maybe - certainly not from lack of effort.

The other thing that enabled us to succeed in those high-talent years was coaching and scheme (O’Leary, Friedgen, CPJ). So the second question is can the coaching from the Collins regime elevate the talent we’re getting to a level that can do stuff as special as those seasons I named. It’s too soon to tell, but some of the early indications aren’t great. We’ll see.

JRjr
 
smokey_wasp said:
Because of the offensive transition, but it turned out switching into the 3O with super talented players is a lot different from switching out of it with a depleted roster. A lot of people thought CGC was going to go 1-11 in his first year and we were picked dead last in the ACC last year, too. So I guess he has exceeded projections, too. But what difference, at this point, does it make?
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There is a huge difference in exceeding expectations of 1-11, by going 3-9, than exceeding expectations of 3-9, by going 9-4 and beating uga in the process, or in my mind at least.
 
vapspwi said:
The other thing that enabled us to succeed in those high-talent years was coaching and scheme (O’Leary, Friedgen, CPJ).
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The coaching was excellent but do not discount the value of a seriously stout bevy of OL and DL.
You cannot win without both and Ross understood that completely and recruited accordingly.

CPJ also understood it but failed to understand and adapt to the difference between getting linemen at Navy and getting linemen at Georgia Tech.

In the end, that's what did him in.
 
RWLRAR said:
There is a huge difference in exceeding expectations of 1-11, by going 3-9, than exceeding expectations of 3-9, by going 9-4 and beating uga in the process, or in my mind at least.
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I meant what difference does it make in terms of where we are now. Things were trending downward and TStan decided on a full rebuild and rebrand.
 
JJacket said:
Dwyer, Johnson, Thomas, Walker....



People think I'm batty when I say we were going to beat UGAg in 2008 anyway, even if we had kept Gailey. I'd say 2009 too.

Flunk gate did not help Gailey one bit.
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I'm not sure what you saw in the previous Tech-uga games under Gailey that made you think suddenly we were going to win the next two in a row?
 
AmpuTECHture said:
Everyone is gonna disagree on the Dwyer piece (I get it) but ignore this part. Isn't scheme a good part of our success in the first two years? As in not many teams had seen the flexbone, and certainly hadn't seen it with P5 athletes? Those first couple years, I remember so many times where defenses were frequently out of position. öööö I remember the camera guys for ESPN getting fooled at the mesh several plays a game, where they would zoom out of frame and Dwyer was breaking for a 20+ yd gain. Obviously camera guys don't equal opposing teams, but it was clear we outschemed a lot of teams early on, and later in the CPJ tenure, we did not.
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I don't disagree at all. I still remember UGA defenders standing and looking at each other after RJ ran by, puzzled by what just happened. Put those same players in Gailey's traditional scheme and we don't come out of there with a win.
 
ibeeballin said:
Dwyer had a 1st projection until he ate himself out of it
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He was a 1st round projection based on his stats, he dropped after his measurables were evaluated at the combine. Flexbone can inflate your stats; but it can't fix your 40 time.
 
aeromech said:
He was a 1st round projection based on his stats, he dropped after his measurables were evaluated at the combine. Flexbone can inflate your stats; but it can't fix your 40 time.
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Dwyer was a low 4.4 and it showed on film especially 2008. Dwyer went from a 220lbs monster to almost 250lb. That what slowed him down
 
aeromech said:
He was a 1st round projection based on his stats, he dropped after his measurables were evaluated at the combine. Flexbone can inflate your stats; but it can't fix your 40 time.
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Totally wrong. He was a 1st round projection based precisely on measurables and athletic ability and upside. You don't think putting on a ton of weight affects your measurables and 40 time?

You have to be doing it on purpose to have it this backward. lol
 
smokey_wasp said:
Totally wrong. He was a 1st round projection based precisely on measurables and athletic ability and upside. You don't think putting on a ton of weight affects your measurables and 40 time?

You have to be doing it on purpose to have it this backward. lol
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He was overweight the entire last year at GT. His draft value went down after the combine.

Regardless Gailey would not have beaten UGA just because he was on the roster; just like he couldn't do it with Choice and Johnson on the roster.
 
ibeeballin said:
Such a cop out on the recruiting. So you’re telling me we didn’t offer the best talent in the state on offense?
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Probably not all of them. We had a very small staff and budget. We didn’t have staff to keep up with guys and keep us on their list their Fr, So, and Jr seasons. Recruiting has lots of parts. Dabo knows it, that’s why it got beefed up while he was there. Stansbury knows it. Increasing the budget was one of the first things he did. And our 2018 class showed it over the 16 and 17 classes.

CGC increased the budget even more when he got here. Jimbo left FSU over funding.

And we are going to have to step up from where we are if we want to do better than third best in our division for recruiting.
 
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rghoae said:
That’s arguable.
Chan Gailey coached almost entirely under scholarship restrictions. Pretty much the moment those restrictions were removed he went ahead and recruited one of the most epic recruiting classes tech has seen in decades. And that recruiting class was immediately available to CPJ but Gailey never got a chance to use it.
Also, using CPJ’s metrics, Chan Gailey had 0 losing ACC (or overall) seasons.
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I guess it’s arguable in the sense that anything is arguable. But, no, it’s not arguable.
 
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