If StinGTalk is representative of the fan base

BuzzLaw said:
He lost ST yesterday. I don’t see him gaining it back for an extended time.
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Eh. I’ve seen worse meltdowns. There is a sizable minority of us ready to see him go regardless of what happens the rest of the year, but I think after a win next weekend most of this board will be back on the train.
 
Diseqc said:
There is a sizable minority of us ready to see him go regardless of what happens the rest of the year
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Surely not. If we have a good season, why would you want to fire him?
 
BuzzLaw said:
Then it means a lot of things, but it also means PJ has lost the fans. He and GT need to plan an exit for him.

I still want him here as coach, but no matter how good he does, every loss will have replies like yesterday. He can win the coastal and still be on the hot seat.

Sad to say it, and even sadder for the likely worse coach we’ll get, but it’s time to make a change.
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Not really. We have had hard fought losses in the past where ST and the fanbase were generally pleased with our performance, or at least not displeased for these specific reasons. FSU in the ACCCG comes to mind, and I'm sure there are other examples. I think the reason everyone is mad is because we looked like clowns in the 4th quarter in just about every phase of the game, in addition to the dumb KO returns, which is sort of a pattern recently. We gave up 21 straight points (4 of 5 drives in the 2nd half we gave up TDs) and couldn't score even a FG on an opponent who we had reeling all through the third. You can attribute that to whatever you want, injuries, refs, black magic, but it's true. This is the product that Paul Johnson has fielded for you now for a season and a game, at least. At the end of the day he's the guy who has to develop the systems to control the quality of our product, and he's had 10 years to do it. Whatever he's doing is no longer effective, and it's starting to sound like he doesn't have the answers to get us back to playing at the high level he's shown us we can. Maybe that's his fault, maybe it isn't. It doesn't really matter to me, or to a whole lot of other people. The guy needs to at least tell us he has a real plan to deal with the reality of the situation, or he needs to go. All signals from him right now are that he thinks he's doing what needs to be done, and it's bewildering to him why it isn't working. I simplify that in my mind to some unflattering things that could very well be wrong, I don't know the man personally, but at any rate, it isn't going to cut it.

If he comes out and bootyblasts Pitt and wins the coastal I think most fans will let this one go. But that's not going to happen if we can't cover kicks, tackle on defense, or stop shooting ourselves in the foot with ball security and penalties. I'm not replete with confidence that these things will be fixed, which is why I am on the other side of the fence now, and I suspect that's really where most of us are. I don't have any ill will towards CPJ, I don't mind his personality or his offense or his recruiting or whatever. I don't pretend to know the solutions, or even whether any exist. I just know it isn't working, and when something isn't working, I tend to want to try something else. Keeping on going with something you know isn't working feels a lot like just giving up.
 
ThisIsAtlanta said:
Not really. We have had hard fought losses in the past where ST and the fanbase were generally pleased with our performance, or at least not displeased for these specific reasons. FSU in the ACCCG comes to mind, and I'm sure there are other examples. I think the reason everyone is mad is because we looked like clowns in the 4th quarter in just about every phase of the game, in addition to the dumb KO returns, which is sort of a pattern recently. We gave up 21 straight points (4 of 5 drives in the 2nd half we gave up TDs) and couldn't score even a FG on an opponent who we had reeling all through the third. You can attribute that to whatever you want, injuries, refs, black magic, but it's true. This is the product that Paul Johnson has fielded for you now for a season and a game, at least. At the end of the day he's the guy who has to develop the systems to control the quality of our product, and he's had 10 years to do it. Whatever he's doing is no longer effective, and it's starting to sound like he doesn't have the answers to get us back to playing at the high level he's shown us we can. Maybe that's his fault, maybe it isn't. It doesn't really matter to me, or to a whole lot of other people. The guy needs to at least tell us he has a real plan to deal with the reality of the situation, or he needs to go. All signals from him right now are that he thinks he's doing what needs to be done, and it's bewildering to him why it isn't working. I simplify that in my mind to some unflattering things that could very well be wrong, I don't know the man personally, but at any rate, it isn't going to cut it.

If he comes out and bootyblasts Pitt and wins the coastal I think most fans will let this one go. But that's not going to happen if we can't cover kicks, tackle on defense, or stop shooting ourselves in the foot with ball security and penalties. I'm not replete with confidence that these things will be fixed, which is why I am on the other side of the fence now, and I suspect that's really where most of us are. I don't have any ill will towards CPJ, I don't mind his personality or his offense or his recruiting or whatever. I don't pretend to know the solutions, or even whether any exist. I just know it isn't working, and when something isn't working, I tend to want to try something else. Keeping on going with something you know isn't working feels a lot like just giving up.
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Really good post and right where I am
 
ThisIsAtlanta said:
Not really. We have had hard fought losses in the past where ST and the fanbase were generally pleased with our performance, or at least not displeased for these specific reasons. FSU in the ACCCG comes to mind, and I'm sure there are other examples. I think the reason everyone is mad is because we looked like clowns in the 4th quarter in just about every phase of the game, in addition to the dumb KO returns, which is sort of a pattern recently. We gave up 21 straight points (4 of 5 drives in the 2nd half we gave up TDs) and couldn't score even a FG on an opponent who we had reeling all through the third. You can attribute that to whatever you want, injuries, refs, black magic, but it's true. This is the product that Paul Johnson has fielded for you now for a season and a game, at least. At the end of the day he's the guy who has to develop the systems to control the quality of our product, and he's had 10 years to do it. Whatever he's doing is no longer effective, and it's starting to sound like he doesn't have the answers to get us back to playing at the high level he's shown us we can. Maybe that's his fault, maybe it isn't. It doesn't really matter to me, or to a whole lot of other people. The guy needs to at least tell us he has a real plan to deal with the reality of the situation, or he needs to go. All signals from him right now are that he thinks he's doing what needs to be done, and it's bewildering to him why it isn't working. I simplify that in my mind to some unflattering things that could very well be wrong, I don't know the man personally, but at any rate, it isn't going to cut it.

If he comes out and bootyblasts Pitt and wins the coastal I think most fans will let this one go. But that's not going to happen if we can't cover kicks, tackle on defense, or stop shooting ourselves in the foot with ball security and penalties. I'm not replete with confidence that these things will be fixed, which is why I am on the other side of the fence now, and I suspect that's really where most of us are. I don't have any ill will towards CPJ, I don't mind his personality or his offense or his recruiting or whatever. I don't pretend to know the solutions, or even whether any exist. I just know it isn't working, and when something isn't working, I tend to want to try something else. Keeping on going with something you know isn't working feels a lot like just giving up.
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I agree with all this, except this part:
The guy needs to at least tell us he has a real plan to deal with the reality of the situation...
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It's been no secret for years our problem has been developing a consistent D. CPJ's plan to deal with this? Fire a GT legend in favor of somebody who would coach a more aggressive D, where the players can play less encumbered by responsibilities and play calls and the like – all things most fans thought were badly needed.

I feel like the board is letting our frustration with Groh and Roof the past few years color our appraisal of Woody. The dude's only had two games to coach. The first one was our first shutout in a decade. The second one we got pantsed. Let's keep the pitchforks in the barn for a few more weeks at least, and give Woody a chance to get the players doing what he wants. Maybe it'll work, maybe it won't, but CPJ has certainly recognized the problem and is certainly trying to fix it. We're in the midst of an attempted solution. Let's see if it works.

Though for CPJ's sake, Woody better work fast.
 
ThisIsAtlanta said:
Not really. We have had hard fought losses in the past where ST and the fanbase were generally pleased with our performance, or at least not displeased for these specific reasons. FSU in the ACCCG comes to mind, and I'm sure there are other examples. I think the reason everyone is mad is because we looked like clowns in the 4th quarter in just about every phase of the game, in addition to the dumb KO returns, which is sort of a pattern recently. We gave up 21 straight points (4 of 5 drives in the 2nd half we gave up TDs) and couldn't score even a FG on an opponent who we had reeling all through the third. You can attribute that to whatever you want, injuries, refs, black magic, but it's true. This is the product that Paul Johnson has fielded for you now for a season and a game, at least. At the end of the day he's the guy who has to develop the systems to control the quality of our product, and he's had 10 years to do it. Whatever he's doing is no longer effective, and it's starting to sound like he doesn't have the answers to get us back to playing at the high level he's shown us we can. Maybe that's his fault, maybe it isn't. It doesn't really matter to me, or to a whole lot of other people. The guy needs to at least tell us he has a real plan to deal with the reality of the situation, or he needs to go. All signals from him right now are that he thinks he's doing what needs to be done, and it's bewildering to him why it isn't working. I simplify that in my mind to some unflattering things that could very well be wrong, I don't know the man personally, but at any rate, it isn't going to cut it.

If he comes out and bootyblasts Pitt and wins the coastal I think most fans will let this one go. But that's not going to happen if we can't cover kicks, tackle on defense, or stop shooting ourselves in the foot with ball security and penalties. I'm not replete with confidence that these things will be fixed, which is why I am on the other side of the fence now, and I suspect that's really where most of us are. I don't have any ill will towards CPJ, I don't mind his personality or his offense or his recruiting or whatever. I don't pretend to know the solutions, or even whether any exist. I just know it isn't working, and when something isn't working, I tend to want to try something else. Keeping on going with something you know isn't working feels a lot like just giving up.
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So Woody has a couple games to get the defense working or we’re ready to swap coaches? That’s my point. PJ has lost ST. If we give up a ST touchdown and the defense blows next week but we win 45-42, I suspect the feelings won’t change.

I’m not blaming folks for being at their breaking point. I’m just pointing out that, right or wrong, a lot more folks stopped supporting PJ yesterday. And if that attitude carries across the fan base, the PJ era needs to come to a close
 
18in32 said:
I agree with all this, except this part:

It's been no secret for years our problem has been developing a consistent D. CPJ's plan to deal with this? Fire a GT legend in favor of somebody who would coach a more aggressive D, where the players can play less encumbered by responsibilities and play calls and the like – all things most fans thought were badly needed.

I feel like the board is letting our frustration with Groh and Roof the past few years color our appraisal of Woody. The dude's only had two games to coach. The first one was our first shutout in a decade. The second one we got pantsed. Let's keep the pitchforks in the barn for a few more weeks at least, and give Woody a chance to get the players doing what he wants. Maybe it'll work, maybe it won't, but CPJ has certainly recognized the problem and is certainly trying to fix it. We're in the midst of an attempted solution. Let's see if it works.

Though for CPJ's sake, Woody better work fast.
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I don't think it's an issue of scheme that I'm really fingering as "the reality of the situation", although our scheme didn't appear to be very effective against USF at all in the second half once their QB decided the 50 yard void in the middle of the field looked very inviting for rushing stats. The reality of the situation is that a lot of our guys on defense don't even make an attempt to do fundamental football 101 things consistently like wrap up on their tackles, or not completely overshoot their target and just fly past him without contact. I recall at least one play where we had guys in great position to defend a bubble screen, both got past their blockers and were three, maybe four feet from the WR when he caught the ball, standing still, then they both completely missed him (I think one guy might have got a single hand on him) and he ran for a bunch of yards before we brought him down from behind. That stuff was all over the field all day, and on kickoffs, too. If CPJ's plan to deal with that was to let Woody deal with that, then he doesn't really have a plan, because I'm not buying that it wasn't obvious before the game that at least some of our guys were so very awful at it. Worse, I recall articles quoting our guys who thought they could be one of the best defenses in the nation, and something about a 3 deep! Out of control, is about the only thing I can think about it. Somebody really close to the situation is missing something huge.
 
Uga was in a similar position and they pulled the plug. They knew it was a gamble firing a guy with marks success. God knows I am not comparing our relative joke of a football program to uga By any stretch. But sometimes change is good. Other times change is necessary.
 
ThisIsAtlanta said:
I don't think it's an issue of scheme that I'm really fingering as "the reality of the situation", although our scheme didn't appear to be very effective against USF at all in the second half once their QB decided the 50 yard void in the middle of the field looked very inviting for rushing stats. The reality of the situation is that a lot of our guys on defense don't even make an attempt to do fundamental football 101 things consistently like wrap up on their tackles, or not completely overshoot their target and just fly past him without contact. I recall at least one play where we had guys in great position to defend a bubble screen, both got past their blockers and were three, maybe four feet from the WR when he caught the ball, standing still, then they both completely missed him (I think one guy might have got a single hand on him) and he ran for a bunch of yards before we brought him down from behind. That stuff was all over the field all day, and on kickoffs, too. If CPJ's plan to deal with that was to let Woody deal with that, then he doesn't really have a plan, because I'm not buying that it wasn't obvious before the game that at least some of our guys were so very awful at it. Worse, I recall articles quoting our guys who thought they could be one of the best defenses in the nation, and something about a 3 deep! Out of control, is about the only thing I can think about it. Somebody really close to the situation is missing something huge.
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Not that we were completely stopping them beforehand, but we did lose Oliver and Curry.
 
Dirty Jacket said:
Uga was in a similar position and they pulled the plug. They knew it was a gamble firing a guy with marks success. God knows I am not comparing our relative joke of a football program to uga By any stretch. But sometimes change is good. Other times change is necessary.
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You left out the obvious: sometimes change is bad.

I personally believe a change will be bad, but it is growing more and more necessary.
 
BuzzLaw said:
So Woody has a couple games to get the defense working or we’re ready to swap coaches? That’s my point. PJ has lost ST. If we give up a ST touchdown and the defense blows next week but we win 45-42, I suspect the feelings won’t change.

I’m not blaming folks for being at their breaking point. I’m just pointing out that, right or wrong, a lot more folks stopped supporting PJ yesterday. And if that attitude carries across the fan base, the PJ era needs to come to a close
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BuzzLaw said:
Not that we were completely stopping them beforehand, but we did lose Oliver and Curry.
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Losing two guys isn't really an excuse for our backups to be unsound, technique-wise. I could understand if schematically they didn't know where to be, or if they attempted good tackles but were fought off by senior athleticism or whatever, but that's not what was happening. It's like our guys just forgot how to do basic football things at times that was so frustrating. That just says to me that CPJ isn't effective at controlling the quality on that side of the ball. Either he's not able to discover it, or he's not looking for it, or there's nothing he can do about it, but none of those is really something I care to put up with at the head coach position. He's the guy who is supposed to have a plan for this. I just don't see what it is.

I'm also not expecting Woody's defense to be blanking folks or working perfectly two games in. If we go out and beat Pitt 45-42 and it's because we have guys out of position, or we just cant handle Pitt's line, or whatever, I'd be a lot more forgiving of that than if we go out there and just bounce off of and run by a bunch of guys we should be attempting to tackle. I get that it takes time to install a system and recruit players for it, but in the mean time you can definitely still teach any of these kids to wrap up every time.
 
GTplusCPJequalsSuccess said:
I want a change even though my handle may not suggest it. It’s just time. I think there are a myriad of issues but none more important than the message seems to have just gotten stale. Once that happens it’s really tough to bounce back from. Winning would sure help but honestly we appear to be the same exact team as last year and Roof was the scape goat and deservedly so, but at this point I can’t blame anyone else but the head coach.

And yes firing the most successful head coach in our modern history is tough but things change. And we have to change too. Since 2014 we have seen a real drop off in talent and coaching while other programs have made changes and gotten better.

What we saw yesterday looked exactly like what we saw last year. Which tells me that things cannot be expected to improve. OL issues, defensive miscues, atrocious special teams play and failing to mentally close out games. All of these things I could apply to last year too. It’s a recurring trend. And if you can accept that, then by all means that’s your right as a fan. It’s comfortable knowing that every once in a while we might sneak up on a big boy program and beat them with our unconventional offense which is awesome when it’s working. But it’s the failure to produce consistent results that bothers me and why I am okay with moving on.
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This is a reasonable critique of the Johnson regime. I’m pretty close to agreeing completely.
 
GTplusCPJequalsSuccess said:
I want a change even though my handle may not suggest it. It’s just time. I think there are a myriad of issues but none more important than the message seems to have just gotten stale. Once that happens it’s really tough to bounce back from. Winning would sure help but honestly we appear to be the same exact team as last year and Roof was the scape goat and deservedly so, but at this point I can’t blame anyone else but the head coach.

And yes firing the most successful head coach in our modern history is tough but things change. And we have to change too. Since 2014 we have seen a real drop off in talent and coaching while other programs have made changes and gotten better.

What we saw yesterday looked exactly like what we saw last year. Which tells me that things cannot be expected to improve. OL issues, defensive miscues, atrocious special teams play and failing to mentally close out games. All of these things I could apply to last year too. It’s a recurring trend. And if you can accept that, then by all means that’s your right as a fan. It’s comfortable knowing that every once in a while we might sneak up on a big boy program and beat them with our unconventional offense which is awesome when it’s working. But it’s the failure to produce consistent results that bothers me and why I am okay with moving on.
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Why you rotten, miserable, negative SOB. You should go to Dawgrant where you belong! :loser:
 
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