Official argue about the old coach thread

[PressManCoverage]

I loved the CPJ years. My favorite part about them was that I knew we always had a chance, even with a talent disparity. I knew that we had a coach that could actually… coach. I loved watching our players outplay and outsmart players that were supposedly better and I loved seeing how mad their fans got when it happened. In the good years, this was happening on almost a weekly basis. In the bad years, the talent disparity was just too large.

CGC has proven he can recruit. He hasn’t proven he can coach. If we are truly at a point where we don’t want to accept CPJ’s “mediocrity” then why would we blithely accept now losing repeatedly to teams with similar or even lesser talent? That just blows my mind? FWIW I do support CGC, think he was the right hire, and have absolutely not given up on him, but the excuse-making from the people who were desperate to get rid of the option is nauseating sometimes.

To address the 1st paragraph above:

Remember Kansas, MTSU, USF, BYU (back2back), Duke (pick a year) when did we ever out smart Teams, even under CPJ we made Tons of mental mistakes, CPJ also got fat adding an extra cupcake just so he could pad his Record.

Gailey played Aubie & ND out of Conference and didn't mind playing real Teams, while CPJ wanted to pad his resume vs garbage lower level crap from the Carolinas like Woodford and W Carolina or an FCS Team, my theory is that CPJ knew his linemen were undersized and he tried to schedule as weak as he could to try and steal an extra win among our ACC Games by reducing the physicality of our OoC Gms.

To address the 2nd paragraph:

People keep saying we are losing to teams with lesser talent, but not along both Lines of Scrimmage, other than Citadel, a loss marred by tons of pre snap penalties and unforced errors, we haven't had better interior lines than a USF or a NIL this year, remember that Recruiting is pretty accurate at the upper Levels, but by the Time you get down to the #300 ranked OT or the #350 ranked OG (rankings similar to our current OLs when they came out of HS), There is a chance that guys at Duke or at a NIL could be better players than our Players along the LOS

Just because we can Recruit skill players that doesn't mean we have a clear cut advantage in the interior lines where Games are won or lost.

Too many GT fans refuse to look at the Game in the trenches that is a more accurate indicator of where we are as a FB Program.

Why don't guys like you ever ask how would CGC & CDP & CAT coaching acumen look if the previous HC left behind 4 NFL DLinemen, like Chan did when he left?

Why don't any of the CPJ fanboyz employ the "Vacation Cabin Philosophy", leave the FB Program the way it was when you found it (NFL Talent all over the place on both sides of the Ball with 21 out of 22 positions being very strong), why not hold CPJ to that standard?

I wonder how CDP's play calling would look with a 6-3 230lb WR that runs a sub 4.4 forty and is a physical mismatch for anyone on our sked, even ND and SEC opponents, add in an NFL Caliber LT in Andrew Gardner as well?

If CPJ leaves behind that kind of talent, then CDP is probably being mentioned for open HC Jobs at the P5 Level

 

[aeromech]

We lost to Kansas in his third year (2nd game of the season).

You really ought to stop posting now.

Obviously the sarcasm as lost on you too; but the conversation was about Duke only, not overall.

Are you having trouble reading Tampa Jacket's post?? My post was sarcasm because Tampa apparently did not know that the great players in that famous 2007 class left early. I let the previous posts about 'Dwyer's senior year' slide; but TP's post was silly. Even if they didn't leave early for the NFL Dwyer and most of the others played one year for Gailey and only had 3 seasons max for CPJ, not 4. The discussion is, was, and continues to be about wins over Duke, not the overall season record. At most you can credit Gailey's recruits for 2 of CPJ's wins over Duke.

 

[aeromech]

To address the 1st paragraph above:

Remember Kansas, MTSU, USF, BYU (back2back), Duke (pick a year) when did we ever out smart Teams, even under CPJ we made Tons of mental mistakes, CPJ also got fat adding an extra cupcake just so he could pad his Record.

Gailey played Aubie & ND out of Conference and didn't mind playing real Teams, while CPJ wanted to pad his resume vs garbage lower level crap from the Carolinas like Woodford and W Carolina or an FCS Team, my theory is that CPJ knew his linemen were undersized and he tried to schedule as weak as he could to try and steal an extra win among our ACC Games by reducing the physicality of our OoC Gms.

I am pretty certain that the AD sets up the schedule. I remember Homer Rice remarking when he got to GT that we had the hardest schedule in the SEC and that we had been out of that conference for years. (Bobby Dodd was apparently asleep at the wheel) Head coaches I am sure are consulted; but the schedule is set in large part by the AD from what I understand.

To address the 2nd paragraph:

People keep saying we are losing to teams with lesser talent, but not along both Lines of Scrimmage, other than Citadel, a loss marred by tons of pre snap penalties and unforced errors, we haven't had better interior lines than a USF or a NIL this year, remember that Recruiting is pretty accurate at the upper Levels, but by the Time you get down to the #300 ranked OT or the #350 ranked OG (rankings similar to our current OLs when they came out of HS), There is a chance that guys at Duke or at a NIL could be better players than our Players along the LOS

Just because we can Recruit skill players that doesn't mean we have a clear cut advantage in the interior lines where Games are won or lost.

Too many GT fans refuse to look at the Game in the trenches that is a more accurate indicator of where we are as a FB Program.

Why don't guys like you ever ask how would CGC & CDP & CAT coaching acumen look if the previous HC left behind 4 NFL DLinemen, like Chan did when he left?

Why don't any of the CPJ fanboyz employ the "Vacation Cabin Philosophy", leave the FB Program the way it was when you found it (NFL Talent all over the place on both sides of the Ball with 21 out of 22 positions being very strong), why not hold CPJ to that standard?

I wonder how CDP's play calling would look with a 6-3 230lb WR that runs a sub 4.4 forty and is a physical mismatch for anyone on our sked, even ND and SEC opponents, add in an NFL Caliber LT in Andrew Gardner as well?

If CPJ leaves behind that kind of talent, then CDP is probably being mentioned for open HC Jobs at the P5 Level

First there is no doubt that CPJ inherited a better DL than he left or was even capable of assembling the whole time he was here. I've been told we can thank Giff Smith for those DL's during the Gailey years.

Second, we were not strong at 21 of 22 positions when Gailey left. If you remember our OL's in 2008 & 2009 were a scrapped together assembly that included a walk-on at center and a converted TE at OT, and had very little depth, we were just fortunate to keep guys healthy. LB's were nothing to shout about and Richt exploited that in 2009. There were other weak areas as well; but the system helped covered them up because out opponents were concentrated on 'figuring out' the TO. The belief that Gailey left an all NFL cast at every position is frustrating.

Our problems currently on the OL aren't as much the physical quality of the players as it is coaching. We don't have guys getting blown up and shoved into the quarterback as much as we have guys flat missing assignments and having defenders run free. If it was just one guy missing assignments we could attribute it to the player; but when it is happening all across the line the problem appears to be elsewhere. That said, I thought our pass protection looked improved against Duke. Maybe it was just Duke or maybe it is me being optimistic; but I thought we looked better at establishing and maintaining a pocket. Run blocking didn't look much better though. Being optimistic I am hoping progress continues coming out of the bye week, it would be a welcome surprise.

DL needs the right bodies, and think they are coming and people will eventually be satisfied with Thacker when they arrive. Could be as early as next season.

 

[knoxjacket]

We lost to Kansas in his third year (2nd game of the season).

You really ought to stop posting now.

No excuse for losing to either but it’s abundantly clear that Kansas team was significantly worse than NIU.

 

[PressManCoverage]

@aeromech

I didn't mean to mislead you that 21 out of 22 positions were manned by NFL Caliber guys.

What I meant was, we were reasonably strong for a P5 Team at all positions except QB, hence the 21 out of 22

Andrew Gardner & Cord Howard were 2 guys that made the NFL from our OLine, imagine how much different we'd look with 2 NFL Caliber OLs and a Colin Peek at TE (that played important minutes at Bama)?

Gailey had GT FB in great shape, except for QB, in that instance the Power Brokers behind the scenes should have hired a "QB Guru" or an Offensive Guy to pick up where Chan left off, maybe keep Tenuta around, but whatever you do, when a Team is only missing a QB , you never tear it down to the "two by fours" and install a triple option, that was an idiot move by our power brokers behind the scenes that are idiots when it comes to CFB.

We talk so much about being the smartest guys in the Room, but for the better part of 70 years we haven't out smarted anyone in the Deep South WRT CFB.

Everyone around us seems to make smarter, more strategic decisions than we do

 

[RamblinWreck92]

No excuse for losing to either but it’s abundantly clear that Kansas team was significantly worse than NIU.

NIU was no worse than getting boat-raced by MTSU @ home in 2012, 49-28. That was year 5, not year 2.

 

[THWG247]

I wonder how CDP's play calling would look with a 6-3 230lb WR that runs a sub 4.4 forty and is a physical mismatch for anyone on our sked, even ND and SEC opponents, add in an NFL Caliber LT in Andrew Gardner as well?

If CPJ leaves behind that kind of talent, then CDP is probably being mentioned for open HC Jobs at the P5 Level

not to mention Dwyer and a QB- Nesbitt who was designed specially by God to run your preferred offensive scheme

 

[aeromech]

NIU was no worse than getting boat-raced by MTSU @ home in 2012, 49-28. That was year 5, not year 2.

We are in year 3 not 2; but the NIU loss isn't looking as bad as I thought at the start of the season. NIU is the top team in the Mid-American conference presently. If we finish the year with 7 wins like the 2012 team did I will be more than happy, it will be tough but it's possible.

 

[RamblinWreck92]

We are in year 3 not 2; but the NIU loss isn't looking as bad as I thought at the start of the season. NIU is the top team in the Mid-American conference presently. If we finish the year with 7 wins like the 2012 team did I will be more than happy, it will be tough but it's possible.

2020 was a throwaway season IMO.

The 2024 season (5 years in) will be a better comparison. PJ had 100% of his guys when they quit on him at home vs MTSU. CGC doesn't have that yet.

 

[1982Jacket]

Most wins versus UGA by yearly opponents, 2008-2018:
Florida - 6
South Carolina - 4
Auburn - 3
Georgia Tech - 3
Tennessee - 3

We did as well as Auburn and Tennessee, both of which have financial and recruiting advantages over Tech.

What recruiting advantages do Tennessee and Auburn have over Tech? And what about South Carolina - do they have recruiting advantages over Tech, too?

 

[1982Jacket]

@aeromech

I didn't mean to mislead you that 21 out of 22 positions were manned by NFL Caliber guys.

What I meant was, we were reasonably strong for a P5 Team at all positions except QB, hence the 21 out of 22

Andrew Gardner & Cord Howard were 2 guys that made the NFL from our OLine, imagine how much different we'd look with 2 NFL Caliber OLs and a Colin Peek at TE (that played important minutes at Bama)?

Gailey had GT FB in great shape, except for QB, in that instance the Power Brokers behind the scenes should have hired a "QB Guru" or an Offensive Guy to pick up where Chan left off, maybe keep Tenuta around, but whatever you do, when a Team is only missing a QB , you never tear it down to the "two by fours" and install a triple option, that was an idiot move by our power brokers behind the scenes that are idiots when it comes to CFB.

We talk so much about being the smartest guys in the Room, but for the better part of 70 years we haven't out smarted anyone in the Deep South WRT CFB.

Everyone around us seems to make smarter, more strategic decisions than we do

The Univerity of South Carolina says, "HI!"

 

[WracerX]

2020 was a throwaway season IMO.

The 2024 season (5 years in) will be a better comparison. PJ had 100% of his guys when they quit on him at home vs MTSU. CGC doesn't have that yet.

No one quit in the mtsu game. Groh just couldn’t get a play call in on time. He was completely befuddled by the hurry up.

The only real quit I saw under Johnson was that last bowl game. Half the team just didn’t care, which is understandable since he quit on them.

 

[RamblinWreck92]

No one quit in the mtsu game. Groh just couldn’t get a play call in on time. He was completely befuddled by the hurry up.

The only real quit I saw under Johnson was that last bowl game. Half the team just didn’t care, which is understandable since he quit on them.

I disagree - the team practically laid down in the 2nd half. Agreed re:last bowl game.

Frankly, that was the only 2 times I saw that happen under PJ. Even in bad losses, PJ teams fought hard til the end, those 2 being exceptions. I see the same thing out of CGC teams so far.

 

[JJacket]

I am pretty certain that the AD sets up the schedule. I remember Homer Rice remarking when he got to GT that we had the hardest schedule in the SEC and that we had been out of that conference for years. (Bobby Dodd was apparently asleep at the wheel) Head coaches I am sure are consulted; but the schedule is set in large part by the AD from what I understand.

To address the 2nd paragraph:



First there is no doubt that CPJ inherited a better DL than he left or was even capable of assembling the whole time he was here. I've been told we can thank Giff Smith for those DL's during the Gailey years.

Second, we were not strong at 21 of 22 positions when Gailey left. If you remember our OL's in 2008 & 2009 were a scrapped together assembly that included a walk-on at center and a converted TE at OT, and had very little depth, we were just fortunate to keep guys healthy. LB's were nothing to shout about and Richt exploited that in 2009. There were other weak areas as well; but the system helped covered them up because out opponents were concentrated on 'figuring out' the TO. The belief that Gailey left an all NFL cast at every position is frustrating.

Our problems currently on the OL aren't as much the physical quality of the players as it is coaching. We don't have guys getting blown up and shoved into the quarterback as much as we have guys flat missing assignments and having defenders run free. If it was just one guy missing assignments we could attribute it to the player; but when it is happening all across the line the problem appears to be elsewhere. That said, I thought our pass protection looked improved against Duke. Maybe it was just Duke or maybe it is me being optimistic; but I thought we looked better at establishing and maintaining a pocket. Run blocking didn't look much better though. Being optimistic I am hoping progress continues coming out of the bye week, it would be a welcome surprise.

DL needs the right bodies, and think they are coming and people will eventually be satisfied with Thacker when they arrive. Could be as early as next season.

We were a missed blocking assignment away from tying/beating Clemson at the end.

 

[aeromech]

2020 was a throwaway season IMO.

The 2024 season (5 years in) will be a better comparison. PJ had 100% of his guys when they quit on him at home vs MTSU. CGC doesn't have that yet.

The 2020 recruiting class and the free season should have been a huge benefit to the rebuild, not a detriment. Don't forget the transfer portal as well. CGC year 3 should be ahead of the traditional year 3. We are solidly in year 3 any way you want to slice it.

 

[aeromech]

We were a missed blocking assignment away from tying/beating Clemson at the end.

True.

 

[aeromech]

No one quit in the mtsu game. Groh just couldn’t get a play call in on time. He was completely befuddled by the hurry up.

The only real quit I saw under Johnson was that last bowl game. Half the team just didn’t care, which is understandable since he quit on them.

The MTSU game Groh couldn't figure out how to stop runs up the middle and they death marched us. I didn't see them quit either; but I was so pissed....

 

[aeromech]

The Univerity of South Carolina says, "HI!"

It is so sad to look at what conference South Carolina was in 70 years ago, what conference GT was in 70 years ago, and which conference each team is in now.

 

[RussianOffense]

What recruiting advantages do Tennessee and Auburn have over Tech? And what about South Carolina - do they have recruiting advantages over Tech, too?

More money, bigger fanbases, fewer academic restrictions, SEC

 

[RussianOffense]

The MTSU game Groh couldn't figure out how to stop runs up the middle and they death marched us. I didn't see them quit either; but I was so pissed....

They were stealing our signals