Stephen Hill just declared for the NFL draft.

lonestarjacket said:
Note that I was one of the last here to give up on Chan, but give up on him I did. And you can play the "what if" game always. What if Chan was on the verge and was about to beat UGA five times? But how many believe that?
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While it is impossible to know what could have been, we can definitely deal in what we do know. CCG's recruits beat ugag in '08 and won the ACC in '09.

lonestarjacket said:
When you hire someone you decide your criteria for success and a reasonable period to achieve that success. Then you stick with it and do not rationalize for one more year because excuses can always be found year to year that happen to all teams but only affect some.

To me, a reasonable period is enough time to have your own recruits as seniors, with a full year to recruit those seniors. So, basically by the fifth year you should see the measure of what you can expect.
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... unless your reasonable period is unreasonable. I don't know about every coaching situation in the history of college football, but for Tech's situation, the fifth year test is unreasonable. To judge CPJ on his first or even second recruiting class is, at best, incomplete, because his best class so far looks to be the '12 class. We have been saying this whole time, "Wait til he gets his players on the field." Well, if he is fired after year 5 or year 6, his players will be on the field in '14 and '15, but he won't be. Deja vu all over again.
 
GT1992 said:
I'll grant you Groh and I think it was a good hire. Although, after the defensive disaster in 2009, I don't think he had much choice. He is unwilling to modify his offense so that he can attract better talent or hire a special teams coach (the current staff isn't getting the job done). He is at the very least, resistant to changes and takes time to implement them (i.e. scholarship kicker). You could argue that it's a positive as well, that he sticks to his guns.
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He changes his offense to do what he feels we can do. There is nothing that you can't do from our offense given the right players. Besides, find me a coach who makes drastic changes in what he does and I'll show you a coach without a job.
 
ncjacket said:
He changes his offense to do what he feels we can do. There is nothing that you can't do from our offense given the right players. Besides, find me a coach who makes drastic changes in what he does and I'll show you a coach without a job.
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Some coaches have a system they trust and try to get players to fit that system. CPJ is now one of those coaches.

Other coaches look at the strengths of who they have available and develop or implement the best system for them. CPJ WAS one of those coaches if you believe his story of how and why he started using his current offense. ( I forget the story I read where he told about his conversation with Erk Russell about finding an offense for their team. )

Fridge does not currently have a job but he had success here by continuously adjusting what he did to fit who was available. The changes were not always drastic and he really was not a system guy, unless you count his multiple offense changes as a system in itself. But the ability to be successful with two QBs as different as Hamilton and Godsey means he adjusted well.

I guess I am saying both approaches can work and neither is inherently better. But a coach who can adjust to his players will always be successful more quickly just because they do not have to wait to get the right players.
 
ncjacket said:
He changes his offense to do what he feels we can do. There is nothing that you can't do from our offense given the right players. Besides, find me a coach who makes drastic changes in what he does and I'll show you a coach without a job.
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But is he getting the right players? I would argue that his emphasis on smaller offensive linemen has come back to bite him. Nebraska's success relied on massive fast OL's and their weight room is a thing of legend. With Uzzi, Shaq, and some of the newer recruits, he might be changing his philosophy.
 
lonestarjacket said:
Some coaches have a system they trust and try to get players to fit that system. CPJ is now one of those coaches.

Other coaches look at the strengths of who they have available and develop or implement the best system for them. CPJ WAS one of those coaches if you believe his story of how and why he started using his current offense. ( I forget the story I read where he told about his conversation with Erk Russell about finding an offense for their team. )

Fridge does not currently have a job but he had success here by continuously adjusting what he did to fit who was available. The changes were not always drastic and he really was not a system guy, unless you count his multiple offense changes as a system in itself. But the ability to be successful with two QBs as different as Hamilton and Godsey means he adjusted well.

I guess I am saying both approaches can work and neither is inherently better. But a coach who can adjust to his players will always be successful more quickly just because they do not have to wait to get the right players.
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You beat me to it and much better written.
 
GT1992 said:
But is he getting the right players? I would argue that his emphasis on smaller offensive linemen has come back to bite him. Nebraska's success relied on massive fast OL's and their weight room is a thing of legend. With Uzzi, Shaq, and some of the newer recruits, he might be changing his philosophy.
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He has never emphasized smaller OL. What he wants is OL who can move and bend and the bigger the better. He's always said that, every time anyone has ever asked. The closest he's come to talking about size of OL is when he's said WTTE that big fat guys who can't move can't play in his system. Nebrasks was also famous for getting walk on OL and letting them spend 2-3 years in the weigth room getting ready to play. The also had a reputation for steroids fwiw.
 
ncjacket said:
He has never emphasized smaller OL. What he wants is OL who can move and bend and the bigger the better. He's always said that, every time anyone has ever asked. The closest he's come to talking about size of OL is when he's said WTTE that big fat guys who can't move can't play in his system. Nebrasks was also famous for getting walk on OL and letting them spend 2-3 years in the weigth room getting ready to play. The also had a reputation for steroids fwiw.
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Check this out. Look at the OL that played this year (and the size of the younger guys) vs. 2009.

http://www.ramblinwreck.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/geot-m-footbl-mtt.html
 
GT1992 said:
Check this out. Look at the OL that played this year (and the size of the younger guys) vs. 2009.

http://www.ramblinwreck.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/geot-m-footbl-mtt.html
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I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be checking out. He has stated numerous times that OL have to be able to move, and can't be fat. If they can do it at 320 that's fine with him. Some of these guys actually came in bigger than those listed weights and lost their baby fat. You're saying he wants smaller OLinemen. I'm saying that's not what he wants...he wants quicker linemen. But he's also said big and quick is better than small and quick.
 
ncjacket said:
I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be checking out. He has stated numerous times that OL have to be able to move, and can't be fat. If they can do it at 320 that's fine with him. Some of these guys actually came in bigger than those listed weights and lost their baby fat. You're saying he wants smaller OLinemen. I'm saying that's not what he wants...he wants quicker linemen. But he's also said big and quick is better than small and quick.
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The "big" ones include 260 pound linemen. While quick, they get run over by modern day defensive linemen at big programs. I think CPJ has realized that it doesn't work week to week. And the OL is where he hasn't produced results.
 
GT1992 said:
The "big" ones include 260 pound linemen. While quick, they get run over by modern day defensive linemen at big programs. I think CPJ has realized that it doesn't work week to week. And the OL is where he hasn't produced results.
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Well what is he going to do? The only way he can consistently get BIG offensive linemen is to switch to a pro style offense. We will always be limited on the prototypical linemen because our offense does not lead to the NFL from that position unless its on measurables alone. If we are recruiting smaller linemen its because the bigger ones will not come here, not cause we turned them down.

We can get bigger linemen though, just look at Shaq Mason. Listed at 295 (as a true freshman) and he looks close to it on the field.
 
Can anyone imagine how bad the Chan years would have been without Calvin Johnson here?
 
JTS said:
I think Hill realizes that if he's going to make money in the NFL it will be on the second contract not the first. Leaving a year early makes him a year younger when / if this big second contract comes. He probably sees an NFL practice squad free of academic distractions as a better place to develop his talents while making a six figure salary btw.

I think that most people would leave school early to pursue a dream job if they knew they would be making $100K for 1-2 years with a chance to make millions for another 2-4 years if things went well. You can always come back and finish school later as long as you put money away for it.

This decision doesn't necessarily say anything bad about the school or our coach.
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This, except it's more obvious. League minimum is like $400,000, not $100,000. Stephen Hill is going to earn more in 3 years in the NFL as a zero snap backup than he would in two decades in business or engineering. It's a no brainer. Go play sports, earn a million bucks, and then get the degree later. If I was sure I'd be drafted (any round) I'd do it.
 
beej67 said:
This, except it's more obvious. League minimum is like $400,000, not $100,000. Stephen Hill is going to earn more in 3 years in the NFL as a zero snap backup than he would in two decades in business or engineering. It's a no brainer. Go play sports, earn a million bucks, and then get the degree later. If I was sure I'd be drafted (any round) I'd do it.
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1.2MM divided by 20 is $60k per year.

Fairly confident he'd earn that in 20 years.

I do, however, get your point. You have to make the team, first, though.
 
Why is this still a thread? As fans we ought to support our SAs no matter what.

I don't think it's the best decision in the world but what are we going to do? Wish the young man the best and watch the next guy step up.
 
gtrower;988551 Come back said:
i'm sure this has been discussed but i don't want to read the whole 5 pages, but once you declare you can't come back, correct?
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buzztheirazz said:
i'm sure this has been discussed but i don't want to read the whole 5 pages, but once you declare you can't come back, correct?
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It's not when you declare but the second you sign an agent. You can declare and still come back as long as you don't get that agent.
 
thnx. i would definitely advise him to not get an agent.

he still has a few things to work on but i think if he can bulk up and put on some weight he could move up into the 2nd round.

just too early i think but he could also blow out a knee next year. hope he stays.
 
buzztheirazz said:
thnx. i would definitely advise him to not get an agent.

he still has a few things to work on but i think if he can bulk up and put on some weight he could move up into the 2nd round.

just too early i think but he could also blow out a knee next year. hope he stays.
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You know so much better than the NFL scouts.
 
beej67 said:
This, except it's more obvious. League minimum is like $400,000, not $100,000. Stephen Hill is going to earn more in 3 years in the NFL as a zero snap backup than he would in two decades in business or engineering. It's a no brainer. Go play sports, earn a million bucks, and then get the degree later. If I was sure I'd be drafted (any round) I'd do it.
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Only 50% of draft picks make the NFL (linked it earlier). He is just as likely to be an undrafted free agent with 0 signing bonus and no guarantee of making a penny. His hands suck and at best he'll make a practice squad this year ($88k, also linked). His chances are slim of seeing a million dollars.
 
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