Expansion Rumors…

Supersize that order mutt said:
Yep, 2-3 years, but that's more than Vandy or KY have ever done.
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Is that what you guys are wanting Tech to be? The next USCe or MSU of the SEC/B1G? To maybe win a division once every 30 years? Not me.

Look, Alabama, UGA, LSU, UF, AU, and UT line their programs 5 deep largely with mental midgets who a) couldn’t make it through year 1 of any Tech curriculum even with the best tutoring known to man, and b) wouldn’t go to Tech if they could because they are looking for the moat direct path to the League. Tech is a real-life high academic university, not a playground for the mentally challenged. Money will not change that. What those schools have done over the last 50 years is build a completely different level of football and have sealed off all but about 15-20 programs.

What Tech can do is rebuild to be in the championship discussion annually in the ACC football. It can be fun again and rewarding for the program. Do we need to raise more money? Yes. Do we need improvement? Absolutely. Can we do that? Sure. Can we compete at the top of a conference that has been completely ruled by 6 teams for over 50 years?
 
stinger78 said:
Is that what you guys are wanting Tech to be? The next USCe or MSU of the SEC/B1G? To maybe win a division once every 30 years? Not me.

Look, Alabama, UGA, LSU, UF, AU, and UT line their programs 5 deep largely with mental midgets who a) couldn’t make it through year 1 of any Tech curriculum even with the best tutoring known to man, and b) wouldn’t go to Tech if they could because they are looking for the moat direct path to the League. Tech is a real-life high academic university, not a playground for the mentally challenged. Money will not change that. What those schools have done over the last 50 years is build a completely different level of football and have sealed off all but about 15-20 programs.

What Tech can do is rebuild to be in the championship discussion annually in the ACC football. It can be fun again and rewarding for the program. Do we need to raise more money? Yes. Do we need improvement? Absolutely. Can we do that? Sure. Can we compete at the top of a conference that has been completely ruled by 6 teams for over 50 years?
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GT has, other than a few years, always been > USCe and we would be > USCe almost immediately upon joining the BIG10 or SEC
 
stinger78 said:
Is that what you guys are wanting Tech to be? The next USCe or MSU of the SEC/B1G? To maybe win a division once every 30 years? Not me.

Look, Alabama, UGA, LSU, UF, AU, and UT line their programs 5 deep largely with mental midgets who a) couldn’t make it through year 1 of any Tech curriculum even with the best tutoring known to man, and b) wouldn’t go to Tech if they could because they are looking for the moat direct path to the League. Tech is a real-life high academic university, not a playground for the mentally challenged. Money will not change that. What those schools have done over the last 50 years is build a completely different level of football and have sealed off all but about 15-20 programs.

What Tech can do is rebuild to be in the championship discussion annually in the ACC football. It can be fun again and rewarding for the program. Do we need to raise more money? Yes. Do we need improvement? Absolutely. Can we do that? Sure. Can we compete at the top of a conference that has been completely ruled by 6 teams for over 50 years?
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You realize GT has a 93% retention graduation rate now right?? It isn't 1978 anymore by a long shot.

Georgia Tech Reaches All-Time High Retention and Graduation Rates | Office of Undergraduate Education (gatech.edu)

Basically anyone who goes to GT gets a diploma unless they decide to leave on their own volition. I am not saying we would be top 10 team every year like Bama; but we could be a consistent top 25 team with a run at the top 5 every 5-6 years if we were in a better conference.
 
stinger78 said:
Is that what you guys are wanting Tech to be? The next USCe or MSU of the SEC/B1G? To maybe win a division once every 30 years? Not me.

Look, Alabama, UGA, LSU, UF, AU, and UT line their programs 5 deep largely with mental midgets who a) couldn’t make it through year 1 of any Tech curriculum even with the best tutoring known to man, and b) wouldn’t go to Tech if they could because they are looking for the moat direct path to the League. Tech is a real-life high academic university, not a playground for the mentally challenged. Money will not change that. What those schools have done over the last 50 years is build a completely different level of football and have sealed off all but about 15-20 programs.

What Tech can do is rebuild to be in the championship discussion annually in the ACC football. It can be fun again and rewarding for the program. Do we need to raise more money? Yes. Do we need improvement? Absolutely. Can we do that? Sure. Can we compete at the top of a conference that has been completely ruled by 6 teams for over 50 years?
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The way things are heading, the ACC (if it continues to exist) is moving toward AAC level in football. The money thing is tearing it’s head even in basketball now.
There is a lot of thinking in Tallahassee and in Clemson that if the SEC or BIG10 comes calling, maybe the best course of action would be to join, tie the GOR crap up in court for 5 years and eventually settle for a reduced amount while reaping the big $ from the other league.
If the ACC loses it’s football powers, then the league really does become AAC level. We can argue the points ad nauseum, but that is the truth.
 
donsue said:
The way things are heading, the ACC (if it continues to exist) is moving toward AAC level in football. The money thing is tearing it’s head even in basketball now.
There is a lot of thinking in Tallahassee and in Clemson that if the SEC or BIG10 comes calling, maybe the best course of action would be to join, tie the GOR crap up in court for 5 years and eventually settle for a reduced amount while reaping the big $ from the other league.
If the ACC loses it’s football powers, then the league really does become AAC level. We can argue the points ad nauseum, but that is the truth.
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And we will be sitting there wondering how we became USF
 
aeromech said:
You realize GT has a 93% retention graduation rate now right?? It isn't 1978 anymore by a long shot.

Georgia Tech Reaches All-Time High Retention and Graduation Rates | Office of Undergraduate Education (gatech.edu)

Basically anyone who goes to GT gets a diploma unless they decide to leave on their own volition. I am not saying we would be top 10 team every year like Bama; but we could be a consistent top 25 team with a run at the top 5 every 5-6 years if we were in a better conference.
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To your first statement: Maybe, but the guys I'm talking about are the very high-level pampered HS football players. Tech is still an extremely challenging school. You don't have to flunk out 33 percent of your students to be that school. My daughter worked with the AA at UGAg for a year taking roll of SAs in their classes every day. You ought to hear her stories. 90% of those guys aren't coming to Tech no matter how much money we raise. However, there are the 10% - guys like CJ (2004), Derrick Morgan (2007), and Gibbs (2020). We can absolutely recruit a few.

However, UGAg's *backup* TE is mocked to be going in the 2nd round of the NFL draft. UGA is predicted to have 3 first round and 2 second rounders in the NFL draft this spring. That's 5 just in the first 2 rounds. This AFTER they had 15 players drafted in 2022.

Do you guys see the level of what we're talking about here?

To your second statement: I agree completely. There is room to compete for the AP top 25 every year now - in the ACC. We don't have to be part of the SECheat/B1G to do that. GOL appeared in the top 25 six times and finished there five times. CPJ also appeared in the top 25 six times and finished there three times. CCG appeared three times but never finished there. So then, for the 27 seasons since 1996, we have appeared in the AP top 25 fifteen times, finishing there 8 times. That's happening now. We went to something like 22 straight bowls.
 
stinger78 said:
To your first statement: Maybe, but the guys I'm talking about are the very high-level pampered HS football players. Tech is still an extremely challenging school. You don't have to flunk out 33 percent of your students to be that school. My daughter worked with the AA at UGAg for a year taking roll of SAs in their classes every day. You ought to hear her stories. 90% of those guys aren't coming to Tech no matter how much money we raise. However, there are the 10% - guys like CJ (2004), Derrick Morgan (2007), and Gibbs (2020). We can absolutely recruit a few.

However, UGAg's *backup* TE is mocked to be going in the 2nd round of the NFL draft. UGA is predicted to have 3 first round and 2 second rounders in the NFL draft this spring. That's 5 just in the first 2 rounds. This AFTER they had 15 players drafted in 2022.

Do you guys see the level of what we're talking about here?

To your second statement: I agree completely. There is room to compete for the AP top 25 every year now - in the ACC. We don't have to be part of the SECheat/B1G to do that. GOL appeared in the top 25 six times and finished there five times. CPJ also appeared in the top 25 six times and finished there three times. CCG appeared three times but never finished there. So then, for the 27 seasons since 1996, we have appeared in the AP top 25 fifteen times, finishing there 8 times. That's happening now. We went to something like 22 straight bowls.
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I'm with you on most of your points. You use factual information in your argument. What I don't understand is why you waste your time with people who have no grasp on reality or just don't want to come to grips with it. Fan is short for fanatic, not fantasy.

But then again, 3-9 or 5-7 in the ACC versus 3-9 or 5-7 in the Big 10 plus $30 million is a better deal. Irrelevant in a bush league vs irrelevant in a top league is better, I guess.
 
stinger78 said:
To your first statement: Maybe, but the guys I'm talking about are the very high-level pampered HS football players. Tech is still an extremely challenging school. You don't have to flunk out 33 percent of your students to be that school. My daughter worked with the AA at UGAg for a year taking roll of SAs in their classes every day. You ought to hear her stories. 90% of those guys aren't coming to Tech no matter how much money we raise. However, there are the 10% - guys like CJ (2004), Derrick Morgan (2007), and Gibbs (2020). We can absolutely recruit a few.

However, UGAg's *backup* TE is mocked to be going in the 2nd round of the NFL draft. UGA is predicted to have 3 first round and 2 second rounders in the NFL draft this spring. That's 5 just in the first 2 rounds. This AFTER they had 15 players drafted in 2022.

Do you guys see the level of what we're talking about here?

To your second statement: I agree completely. There is room to compete for the AP top 25 every year now - in the ACC. We don't have to be part of the SECheat/B1G to do that. GOL appeared in the top 25 six times and finished there five times. CPJ also appeared in the top 25 six times and finished there three times. CCG appeared three times but never finished there. So then, for the 27 seasons since 1996, we have appeared in the AP top 25 fifteen times, finishing there 8 times. That's happening now. We went to something like 22 straight bowls.
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You are living in yesteryear. I don't know how to put it any kinder than that. They game has changed monumentally since the GOL and CCG days; we simply are not living in those times anymore. There is no "maybe" to my first statement either, I posted a link from Georgia Tech to show you the facts. If you aren't going to believe Georgia Tech then I can't help you. The 93% would be even higher if it wasn't for the portal.
 
TechRush said:
I'm with you on most of your points. You use factual information in your argument. What I don't understand is why you waste your time with people who have no grasp on reality or just don't want to come to grips with it. Fan is short for fanatic, not fantasy.

But then again, 3-9 or 5-7 in the ACC versus 3-9 or 5-7 in the Big 10 plus $30 million is a better deal. Irrelevant in a bush league vs irrelevant in a top league is better, I guess.
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What I don't get is why you guys can't pop your head out of the sand and see today's reality? It is as if the past decade simply passed you by. The ACC was a fine conference to be in when GOL and CCG were here; but mismanagement of the conference has put it in steady decline, the idiotic GOR and long term low ball TV contract have insured it will continue to decline. You have to guess if being 5-7 in top league is better than being 5-7 and broke in a bush league??
 
aeromech said:
You are living in yesteryear. I don't know how to put it any kinder than that. They game has changed monumentally since the GOL and CCG days; we simply are not living in those times anymore. There is no "maybe" to my first statement either, I posted a link from Georgia Tech to show you the facts. If you aren't going to believe Georgia Tech then I can't help you. The 93% would be even higher if it wasn't for the portal.
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Maybe so. The next 10 years will tell. I have 50 years of history to derive my position from - all the way up to 2022. It may me yesteryear, but wrt football it is last year. You have -0- history, no trend, nothing. The good thing is that we will see in due time. So as I typed earlier, write your "prediction" down and put it in a shoe box. we will see who is right. It's my opinion and yours. There is no need to argue this further. We will see who's is more accurate. I hope yours is, but I just don't see it happening. Tech is not just now becoming Alabama.
 
aeromech said:
What I don't get is why you guys can't pop your head out of the sand and see today's reality? It is as if the past decade simply passed you by. The ACC was a fine conference to be in when GOL and CCG were here; but mismanagement of the conference has put it in steady decline, the idiotic GOR and long term low ball TV contract have insured it will continue to decline. You have to guess if being 5-7 in top league is better than being 5-7 and broke in a bush league??
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Maybe because we've been watching reality happen for a lot longer than you? Tech is not going to do what it takes to become relevant in a SECheat/B1G league. Write that down; put it under your avatar; remember it. Those that wish for 5-7 +$30M have declared that they are just in it for the money. We all know what that makes them. It's strange, I have so much a higher view of GA Tech and Tech football, yet I'm the one who's "out of step?" Meh.
 
stinger78 said:
Maybe so. The next 10 years will tell. I have 50 years of history to derive my position from - all the way up to 2022. It may me yesteryear, but wrt football it is last year. You have -0- history, no trend, nothing. The good thing is that we will see in due time. So as I typed earlier, write your "prediction" down and put it in a shoe box. we will see who is right. It's my opinion and yours. There is no need to argue this further. We will see who's is more accurate. I hope yours is, but I just don't see it happening. Tech is not just now becoming Alabama.
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Ok historically, how is your 5-year trend line looking? Is it saying, 'stay the course' or 'make changes before you go out of business'? Sears and JCPenney were looking pretty good and had great history a few decades ago too.
 
stinger78 said:
Maybe because we've been watching reality happen for a lot longer than you? Tech is not going to do what it takes to become relevant in a SECheat/B1G league. Write that down; put it under your avatar; remember it. Those that wish for 5-7 +$30M have declared that they are just in it for the money. We all know what that makes them. It's strange, I have so much a higher view of GA Tech and Tech football, yet I'm the one who's "out of step?" Meh.
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Georgia Tech completely changed what they were doing on the academic side to do better in the US News and World Reports rankings to stay relevant. What is your beef with the B1G? It is mostly AAU schools with academic reputations as good and in some cases better than Georgia Tech's. How can you claim to have a higher view of GA Tech and GT Football and simultaneously want to move us to the bush leagues?
 
aeromech said:
Georgia Tech completely changed what they were doing on the academic side to do better in the US News and World Reports rankings to stay relevant. What is your beef with the B1G? It is mostly AAU schools with academic reputations as good and in some cases better than Georgia Tech's. How can you claim to have a higher view of GA Tech and GT Football and simultaneously want to move us to the bush leagues?
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Your response is incorrect on two counts:
1) The "bush leagues" are the ones you want us to move to - those who are just no more than low-level pro leagues. IOW, the SECheat/B1G.
2) I don't want us to move anywhere. Not sure where you got that notion. The ACC will continue to play major college football and will be very competitive in the other sports. What I want is for the programs who desire to sell their souls for money to leave and congregate in their BLP league.

As for the B1G, if we absolutely had to move, that would be my preference for the very reasons you state. However, I cannot see playing at Lincoln NE, Iowa City IA, Minneapolis MN, Champaign IL, Madison WI, W Lafayette IN, Ann Arbor or E Lansing MI, etc. etc. every other stinking game. In October and November, no less. It would be our own version of hell, and all it would serve would be to open the door to GA for intensified poaching by those team. Yeah, that will sure help recruiting.

The course that you guys advocate is not the answer to correcting the issues that are killing college football.
 
aeromech said:
Ok historically, how is your 5-year trend line looking? Is it saying, 'stay the course' or 'make changes before you go out of business'? Sears and JCPenney were looking pretty good and had great history a few decades ago too.
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The 5-year trend sucks. We are in the process of a much-needed change. IMPO, CPJ needed to adapt his system or retire. He retired. TFG should never have been hired. IMPO, he was hired because the former AD bought into his rebranding schtick hook, line, and sinker. However, he was hired, and four years later they are both gone. Changes are underway. Stand by.

What Tech can return to is a solid top-25 program that challenges for our league title year in, year out. That is what I want. How is that a bad thing?
 
stinger78 said:
Maybe so. The next 10 years will tell. I have 50 years of history to derive my position from - all the way up to 2022. It may me yesteryear, but wrt football it is last year. You have -0- history, no trend, nothing. The good thing is that we will see in due time. So as I typed earlier, write your "prediction" down and put it in a shoe box. we will see who is right. It's my opinion and yours. There is no need to argue this further. We will see who's is more accurate. I hope yours is, but I just don't see it happening. Tech is not just now becoming Alabama.
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Alabama didn't become Alabama until Saban showed up. They were good, but nothing special and they had several öööö years.
 
stinger78 said:
The 5-year trend sucks. We are in the process of a much-needed change. IMPO, CPJ needed to adapt his system or retire. He retired. TFG should never have been hired. IMPO, he was hired because the former AD bought into his rebranding schtick hook, line, and sinker. However, he was hired, and four years later they are both gone. Changes are underway. Stand by.

What Tech can return to is a solid top-25 program that challenges for our league title year in, year out. That is what I want. How is that a bad thing?
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I am a strong believer that CPJ started to evolve for Vad Lee's skillet and then regressed back. We would have probably been a lot better team had we at least thrown in 10% pistol designed plays. Hell, start 3-O, shift to pistol and visa versa. We became a one trick pony that UGAg had figured out. Rules changes helped.

We could not ever have had another Cam Chancellor game after rules changes.
 
stinger78 said:
Your response is incorrect on two counts:
1) The "bush leagues" are the ones you want us to move to - those who are just no more than low-level pro leagues. IOW, the SECheat/B1G.
2) I don't want us to move anywhere. Not sure where you got that notion. The ACC will continue to play major college football and will be very competitive in the other sports. What I want is for the programs who desire to sell their souls for money to leave and congregate in their BLP league.

As for the B1G, if we absolutely had to move, that would be my preference for the very reasons you state. However, I cannot see playing at Lincoln NE, Iowa City IA, Minneapolis MN, Champaign IL, Madison WI, W Lafayette IN, Ann Arbor or E Lansing MI, etc. etc. every other stinking game. In October and November, no less. It would be our own version of hell, and all it would serve would be to open the door to GA for intensified poaching by those team. Yeah, that will sure help recruiting.

The course that you guys advocate is not the answer to correcting the issues that are killing college football.
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I think the bolded is the statement all of this contention is about. Many have doubts that statement is true. When they talk about a 5-year trend line, I don't think they mean for GT specifically, I think they mean for the ACC. The conference has not given the appearance of doing well lately, with a lot of teams doing bad and the teams that had been good in the past 10 years seemingly on the decline. Even when ACC teams were competing for national titles, the conference was viewed as weaker due to not so good OOC and bowl showings. The economic situation also has a somewhat bleak outlook with earnings that are increasingly on the lower end of the major conferences and may not have a chance to increase in those next 10 years you mention in the other post.

The conversation feels like it is going nowhere cause the debate keeps going to "can we win outside the ACC" when really the question is "how long will winning in the ACC mean anything"?
 
GTLiebs said:
I think the bolded is the statement all of this contention is about. Many have doubts that statement is true. When they talk about a 5-year trend line, I don't think they mean for GT specifically, I think they mean for the ACC. The conference has not given the appearance of doing well lately, with a lot of teams doing bad and the teams that had been good in the past 10 years seemingly on the decline. Even when ACC teams were competing for national titles, the conference was viewed as weaker due to not so good OOC and bowl showings. The economic situation also has a somewhat bleak outlook with earnings that are increasingly on the lower end of the major conferences and may not have a chance to increase in those next 10 years you mention in the other post.

The conversation feels like it is going nowhere cause the debate keeps going to "can we win outside the ACC" when really the question is "how long will winning in the ACC mean anything"?
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Here's the OOC football record by conference for 2022. It's not as bad as many like to make it out to be. Not great, but not horrendous.
ACC OOC 2022.PNG
 
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