The Geoff Collins Effect!

The Champ said:
Difference being Johnson elevated the performance of the team he inherited, turning 8 win teams into 10 win teams. Collins did the opposite, and turned 10 win teams at temple in to 7 win teams. And now has turned 7 win teams into 3 win teams.
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Umm...that's kind of expected when you inherit a team with all of those future NFL players. Geez, some of you guys are morons.
 
QuadF said:
Collins best player left. It seems that he proved it was difficult to recruit and keep good players.
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Reread what I said. He kept him eligible. Keeping him here was a different story. But that old, tired excuse (which I believed for years as well) of "well, we can't just recruit from the same pool", is horsecrap.
 
daBuzz said:
Reread what I said. He kept him eligible. Keeping him here was a different story. But that old, tired excuse (which I believed for years as well) of "well, we can't just recruit from the same pool", is horsecrap.
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GT’s 2022 recruiting class was ranked 52 and 53rd by the recruiting services. We’re fishing in the same lake, but some teams are going home with the trophies and prize money. We’re competing for the most improved recruiting in 2023 award.
 
Liberty said:
GT’s 2022 recruiting class was ranked 52 and 53rd by the recruiting services. We’re fishing in the same lake, but some teams are going home with the trophies and prize money. We’re competing for the most improved recruiting in 2023 award.
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To that end, he reminds of Dan Uggla with the Braves.


0 for 23.
 
Liberty said:
GT’s 2022 recruiting class was ranked 52 and 53rd by the recruiting services. We’re fishing in the same lake, but some teams are going home with the trophies and prize money. We’re competing for the most improved recruiting in 2023 award.
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You obviously don't subscribe to those recruiting services, or if you do, you don't read what Quinlan et al write. Rivals and 247 both said that their rankings have yet to be changed to reflect the transfer portal and the effect it has on signing classes. ie...if you sign less than 20 high school players, you're penalized.

I'm not defending Collins' coaching job but we most definitely are NOT playing in the same end of the talent pool. To make that claim is ludicrous. For instance, we signed 2 4-star defensive tackles this year...the first time that has ever happened in the history of Georgia Tech football.
 
daBuzz said:
You obviously don't subscribe to those recruiting services, or if you do, you don't read what Quinlan et al write. Rivals and 247 both said that their rankings have yet to be changed to reflect the transfer portal and the effect it has on signing classes. ie...if you sign less than 20 high school players, you're penalized.

I'm not defending Collins' coaching job but we most definitely are NOT playing in the same end of the talent pool. To make that claim is ludicrous. For instance, we signed 2 4-star defensive tackles this year...the first time that has ever happened in the history of Georgia Tech football.
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Everybody uses the portal. I didn't know it until just now because I wasn't even aware there was a portal ranking but our highest ranked transfer is #114. We have eleven 3 stars coming in and 4 something else (2* or unrated I guess). We're number 20 in the transfer portal overall. I guess that's something but the average star rating FWIW is the same as our regular recruiting.

Yeah, we got higher recruiting numbers than Johnson but his offense did not require us to go head to head with the factories. We may have closed the gap somewhat on the recruiting numbers, but if you're now trying to play the same scheme as everyone else with talent that's rated below the competition I'm not sure how you can have a better than average win/loss record unless your coaching is off the chart good.
 
Liberty said:
@Tampa Jacket It was time to turn the page and move to a different coach/scheme, but if I was 61yo and had the means to ride off into the sunset you bet my ass I'd have hung up the headset. There's an angle most GT fans never mention. I'm fairly certain that there was widespread disdain for Sasquatch, but what if Johnson sized up Stansbury and concluded he was Sasquatch 2.0 albeit with an ability to fundraise better. I'm not spending my remaining years trying to help fix the training wheels on a broken bike. It's sorta looking like that scenario now a lot more than it used to.
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Well Said Sir
 
Liberty said:
Everybody uses the portal. I didn't know it until just now because I wasn't even aware there was a portal ranking but our highest ranked transfer is #114. We have eleven 3 stars coming in and 4 something else (2* or unrated I guess). We're number 20 in the transfer portal overall. I guess that's something but the average star rating FWIW is the same as our regular recruiting.

Yeah, we got higher recruiting numbers than Johnson but his offense did not require us to go head to head with the factories. We may have closed the gap somewhat on the recruiting numbers, but if you're now trying to play the same scheme as everyone else with talent that's rated below the competition I'm not sure how you can have a better than average win/loss record unless your coaching is off the chart good.
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Another lie that needs to stop being perpetuated?
 
daBuzz said:
Umm...that's kind of expected when you inherit a team with all of those future NFL players. Geez, some of you guys are morons.
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Yea, and Johnson was better with those NFL players that his predecessor was with NFL players. That was the point. We went from 8 win average in 06-07 to a 10 win average in first two years. He got more out of those guys, which is a sign of good coaching.

On the other hand, GC inherited Pauls 7 win team and can only get 3 wins out of them.
 
Liberty said:
I don't doubt Stansbury has great love for GT. All the love in the world's not gonna make him a good AD though.
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2018: What would you have done if you were the GT AD?

1. Kept Paul Johnson? It would have costed more $.

2. Let Paul Johnson go and hired whom?

Names please. I can’t wait to see the list of coaches you would have hired.

Remember. Stansbury is an idiot who just happened to play D-1 football. And you are the smart one. Please. Show your smarts.

Who would you have hired?
 
The Champ said:
Yea, and Johnson was better with those NFL players that his predecessor was with NFL players. That was the point. We went from 8 win average in 06-07 to a 10 win average in first two years. He got more out of those guys, which is a sign of good coaching.

On the other hand, GC inherited Pauls 7 win team and can only get 3 wins out of them.
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Ahh, so you can see that Paul proved he could win games but he ran the talent level into the ground for the next coach? Glad we agree.
Next topic.
 
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daBuzz said:
Reread what I said. He kept him eligible. Keeping him here was a different story. But that old, tired excuse (which I believed for years as well) of "well, we can't just recruit from the same pool", is horsecrap.
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I caught the nuance, but I was doing a minor pivot to prove the point. Recruiting isn't done once they get here. The stars don't matter if they don't perform or they don't stay, and Geoff has failed on both. I won't pretend I'm not skeptical of the plan being "let's do what everyone else does but better." Recruiting seems to have been the only plan yet we aren't recruiting or coaching as well as gailey.

With the arms race of spending that started under cpj (for recruiting staff and facilities spending) to what we have now (nil money) are we going to be able to keep up enough to stay top 20 recruiting?
 
The Champ said:
Paul was a winner. Geoff is a loser. Glad we agree on that. Enjoy another 3-win season. Next topic.
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Once again, I'm not defending the job Collins has done. But "Paul is a winner" should be amended to "Paul is a winner with inherited talent then he kills the talent pool and leaves you with a bare cupboard as he leaves."

Amazing the way some of you want to make excuses for the pitiful state he left the program in.
 
daBuzz said:
Once again, I'm not defending the job Collins has done. But "Paul is a winner" should be amended to "Paul is a winner with inherited talent then he kills the talent pool and leaves you with a bare cupboard as he leaves."

Amazing the way some of you want to make excuses for the pitiful state he left the program in.
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BS. Paul was a winner wherever he went. Collins has yet to prove that he will ever win consistently and most probably, never will. If he doesn't win at least 6 this year, will be a long time before he ever gets another head coaching position in the college ranks. Most AD's aren't as gullible as TS.
 
cbee said:
BS. Paul was a winner wherever he went. Collins has yet to prove that he will ever win consistently and most probably, never will. If he doesn't win at least 6 this year, will be a long time before he ever gets another head coaching position in the college ranks. Most AD's aren't as gullible as TS.
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So you DON'T agree that Paul left the talent level in the program in shambles?
Then there is really zero need to continue this discussion.

But, if he's such a winner and there was no talent issue, as you claim, then why were we trending downwards his last four years with respect to wins?
2018 -> 7-6
2017 -> 5-6
2016 -> 9-4
2015 -> 3-9

24 wins, 25 losses. Yeah, boy...that's some talented winning right there! You sure showed me and everyone else what a winner Johnson was!
 
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